Setting up Hardware Inserts

[amathie]

I'ld be grateful for some advice. I've read previous posts and the relevant parts of the Pro Tools reference manual but haven't understood how to set up simple hardware inserts.

Just to explain my setup. I'm using Pro Tool 12 HD Native with third party hardware provided by Apogee. I have one Apogee AD16x and one Apogee DA16x run in "advanced routing mode". All this means is that I get 16 analog inputs, 16 digital inputs, 16 analog output and 16 digital outputs. Or looking at it another way I have 32 inputs (half digital) and 32 outputs (half digital).

By default outputs 1-16 are digital and 17-32 are analog.
By default inputs 1-16 are analog and 17-32 are digital.

I want to set up a hardware insert routed via my first analog output (default output 17) and back via my first analog input (default input 1). I understand from the manual that the input and output channels must "correspond" but does this matching refer to the default hardware numbering, or the Pro Tools software numbering?

If it's the former, then it seems I won't be able to use this setup (or possible may have to try to change the routing in the Apogee Maestro software), but if it's the latter, presumably I should be able to reassign the hardware I/O to match the ProTools software in the Pro Tools I/O setup.

To be honest, I'm finding this a little difficult. It was so easy in Nuendo but it's very early days for me in Pro Tools so thanks for any advice you can offer!

[Drew Mazurek]

First, I'd contact Apogee support. They reverse engineered Avid's Digilink protocol (all 3rd party HD interfaces have done this) so it's their responsibility to provide you with support.

Having said that, it works perfectly on my Symphony I/O 16x16.

Which Avid box is the AD16 and DA16 pretending to be? It will say it in the I/O setup window.

Here's mine, I have a few setup. Notice that the Symphony I/O shows up as HD I/O #3.

[john1192]

Originally Posted by amathie

I'ld be grateful for some advice. I've read previous posts and the relevant parts of the Pro Tools reference manual but haven't understood how to set up simple hardware inserts.

Just to explain my setup. I'm using Pro Tool 12 HD Native with third party hardware provided by Apogee. I have one Apogee AD16x and one Apogee DA16x run in "advanced routing mode". All this means is that I get 16 analog inputs, 16 digital inputs, 16 analog output and 16 digital outputs. Or looking at it another way I have 32 inputs (half digital) and 32 outputs (half digital).

By default outputs 1-16 are digital and 17-32 are analog.
By default inputs 1-16 are analog and 17-32 are digital.

I want to set up a hardware insert routed via my first analog output (default output 17) and back via my first analog input (default input 1). I understand from the manual that the input and output channels must "correspond" but does this matching refer to the default hardware numbering, or the Pro Tools software numbering?

If it's the former, then it seems I won't be able to use this setup (or possible may have to try to change the routing in the Apogee Maestro software), but if it's the latter, presumably I should be able to reassign the hardware I/O to match the ProTools software in the Pro Tools I/O setup.

To be honest, I'm finding this a little difficult. It was so easy in Nuendo but it's very early days for me in Pro Tools so thanks for any advice you can offer!

since it is Sunday and you are not going to get anyone at Apogee, i would try reassigning PT I/O .. that should fool PT into submission .. please post back your results .. if this happened to my Lynx this is the 1st thing i would try ..

cheers john

[ChuckS]

When I set up my outboard gear I found it has to be a correspondence in the order the I/O is presented to PT by the drivers. So your analog I/O would have to match either 1-16 or 17-32, they can't be split like you've indicated. So if you can reconfigure it with the Maestro software to align the analog I/O, it should work.

[john1192]

Originally Posted by ChuckS

When I set up my outboard gear I found it has to be a correspondence in the order the I/O is presented to PT by the drivers. So your analog I/O would have to match either 1-16 or 17-32, they can't be split like you've indicated. So if you can reconfigure it with the Maestro software to align the analog I/O, it should work.

so you don't think the PT I/O would do this as well ??? .. i am curious . i am not an Apogee owner ..

[Drew Mazurek]

This is PTHD, it doesn't have a "driver" reporting anything to the app.

Apogee is mimicking an Avid/Digidesign box as all 3rd party Digilink enabled boxes do. So long as the ins and outs are mated up and appear in the I/O setup as "stacked pairs", they will work.

The OP needs to show us a screenshot of the Insert tab of the I/O setup window.

[nigelpry]

Originally Posted by john1192

so you don't think the PT I/O would do this as well ??? .. i am curious . i am not an Apogee owner ..

The i/o 'mapping' has to be done outside of Pro Tools, as PT has no functionality to do this. If there is an option to do this in Apoge's software you do it there, if not you are screwed.

I'm not an Apogee owner either, but know this because if PT did have this facility, anyone with more than 32i/o (like me) would also be able to use it to decide which 32 they want to use at any given moment, rather than being stuck with the first 32i/o PT sees.

Also, my UAD Apollo software has a dedicated PT Mode that has to be switched on the get the i/o aligned, because outputs 1-2 are the dedicated monitor outputs, meaning that other analog outputs are seen by PT as outputs 3-10, whereas analog inputs are seen as inputs 1-8. Apollo PT Mode insert a couple of dummy inputs as inputs 1-2, so analog ins an outs are both seen as 3-10, and so are aligned.

[syMPh]

Maestro lets you remap in and outs assignments to software/hardware. This i know works with pro tools HD if using a symphony PCIe card natively. I can't remember if setting it up to do this is allowed in hd mode.(you need a usb connected so the interface will open in maestro for adjusting settings) .. i'll check tomorrow on my symphony as i have a 8x 8 card and a 16 out card...i only ever inserted the first 8 analog and used the 16 outs for other summing prior to going back to a console.


did you get maestro to work already with mapping?

[amathie]

Thanks for all the helpful posts and apologies for not being able to reply sooner.

I'm using all Apogee hardware natively with a Symphony 64 PCIe card in a Mac Pro tower connected to the AD16x (which is the master clock) and connected on to the DA16x via the AD16x's "thru" port. This is run in advance routing mode as explained in the initial post.

Sorry for not being able to supply screenshots of my I/O setup pages (I'm away from base) but as far as I recall the hardware label at the top of the matrices is "Symphony 64 - Analog 1-32 (although half are actually digital). The left hand column showing the ProTools labels shows the default order:

INPUTS
Line A 1-2
Line A 3-4
... all the way to ...
Line A 15-16
then ...
Digital B 17-18
Digital B 19-20
... all the way to ...
Digital B 31-32

OUTPUTS
Digital A 1-2
Digital A 3-4
... all the way to...
Digital A 15-16
then ...
Analog B 17-18
Analog B 19-20
... all the way to ...
Analog B 31-32

I've tried relabelling the Pro Tools software I/Os in the above list so that analog inputs have the same "label" as the corresponding analog outputs but this didn't work. Similarly I tried reassigning the I/O in Pro Tools so that the analog I/O match positions in the left hand columns, again without any luck. I wasn't really expecting these to work, having read nigelpry's and syMPh's posts explaining the need to reassign the I/O in Apogee's Maestro software before it is presented to Pro Tools, which of course makes much more sense.

When I'm back, I'll be excited to try this and will post whether or not I can get it working.



So, I

[JFreak]

Yes, the I/o pairs need to be presented to PT like:

- analog output 1 --> outside --> analog input 1 (a.k.a "insert 1")
- analog output 2 --> outside --> analog input 2 (a.k.a "insert 2")

...and so on. If the apogee software is unable to map it like this, it won't work.

One thing to consider; can you disable the digital I/o from the Adobee software? That way, I guess, you would only have 16 analog outputs and inputs which could make it possible to use them as inserts.