HD3 VS. HD2 Accel

[HarmonyStudios]

I have an HD 2 non-accel system and am looking to upgrade. My two options are:

1. Get an Accel card, to make my system an HD 3, or
2. Do the exchange program and go from HD 2 non-accel to HD 2 Accel.

Anybody have any insight as to which option I should go with?

[garnoil]

I would go Accel. With today's computers you can run extensive RTAS plugins and the Accel 2 and HD 3 have the same number of voices. Also Acccel is more current but of course for how long? depending on what you do you may even consider HD native?

[formfunction]

Originally Posted by HarmonyStudios

I have an HD 2 non-accel system and am looking to upgrade. My two options are:

1. Get an Accel card, to make my system an HD 3, or
2. Do the exchange program and go from HD 2 non-accel to HD 2 Accel.

Anybody have any insight as to which option I should go with?

If you do the exchange, you gotta get a new computer.
You can add a PCIx accel card for much cheaper, and wait for the new cards to drop in the not too distant future.
It kinda holding half-fast

[HarmonyStudios]

Thanks for the input! I'm getting a new computer regardless. If I stick with the cards I have now and add the one Accel card, I'm going to have to purchase the Magma PCI chassis to make it compatible.

[drumster]

I'm using the PCIe Accel cards, having come on board with PT HD since the Intel days. However, all reports seem to point to the fact that there isn't a big difference in processing power between the PCIx and PCIe cards. That certainly makes a good case for investing in a Magma Chassis until we see what Avid has up it's sleeve for the HD line. A new Mac Pro would allow you to harness the native processing power of your CPU in addition to what you have on the cards.

[subwoof]

Originally Posted by HarmonyStudios

Thanks for the input! I'm getting a new computer regardless. If I stick with the cards I have now and add the one Accel card, I'm going to have to purchase the Magma PCI chassis to make it compatible.

If you go that route, I have an accel card I'd sell you for cheap to make it an Accel 3 system. I am not using it, and I'd love to find a nice home for the little guy.

Email me if interested

[garnoil]

Originally Posted by subwoof

If you go that route, I have an accel card I'd sell you for cheap to make it an Accel 3 system. I am not using it, and I'd love to find a nice home for the little guy.

Email me if interested

Yes, with the computing power of today's computers you do not need a third card (you do not need and HD3). An HD2 is very, very powerful (but you have to use RTAS as well as TDM), HD3 just gives you more processing power but...you have massive processing power on a good current Mac. As far as RTAS goes, some people say that RTAS does not perform that well, in my case I found that RTAS is a s good if not better than TDM at 1.2 the price..case in point Cedar DNS One, is RTAS ONLY, they did not even release a TDM. If you saw one of my sessions you would no believe what can be done with a good mac. Example: 160 audio tracks (mixture of 5.1 stereo, and mono, dynamics and EQ on every single track), 24 Aux inputs (4 convolutions verbs, 2 delays, 1 echo, etc) 1 C channel bus vox with de-ess, de-hum, and comp, 1 LCR walla, 4 music buses with up-mix plugs, 4 dedicated LFE, 5.1 Aux master with EQ, dynamics, Dorrough metering, Waves surround bass manager emulation, and master track (sometimes with C360, and L360 for television mixes) PLUS...1920X1080 HD video.....you want more? I have 13 half hour episodes in ONE (1 single) timelineso I can cut and paste between episodes. It has crashed may be 8 times in 3 months (but I know where the bug is that makes it crash). Re-cap: In my opinion, you should not get an HD3. You should get an HD2 (same number of voices) and use the computer's capabilities and save yourself some money!

I only wish that the voice count of the HD2 could be increased to 256 simultaneous voices, because the new Macs will easily handle than and more....

[Sean Russell]

Originally Posted by garnoil

Yes, with the computing power of today's computers you do not need a third card (you do not need and HD3). An HD2 is very, very powerful (but you have to use RTAS as well as TDM), HD3 just gives you more processing power but...you have massive processing power on a good current Mac. As far as RTAS goes, some people say that RTAS does not perform that well, in my case I found that RTAS is a s good if not better than TDM at 1.2 the price..case in point Cedar DNS One, is RTAS ONLY, they did not even release a TDM. If you saw one of my sessions you would no believe what can be done with a good mac. Example: 160 audio tracks (mixture of 5.1 stereo, and mono, dynamics and EQ on every single track), 24 Aux inputs (4 convolutions verbs, 2 delays, 1 echo, etc) 1 C channel bus vox with de-ess, de-hum, and comp, 1 LCR walla, 4 music buses with up-mix plugs, 4 dedicated LFE, 5.1 Aux master with EQ, dynamics, Dorrough metering, Waves surround bass manager emulation, and master track (sometimes with C360, and L360 for television mixes) PLUS...1920X1080 HD video.....you want more? I have 13 half hour episodes in ONE (1 single) timelineso I can cut and paste between episodes. It has crashed may be 8 times in 3 months (but I know where the bug is that makes it crash). Re-cap: In my opinion, you should not get an HD3. You should get an HD2 (same number of voices) and use the computer's capabilities and save yourself some money!

I only wish that the voice count of the HD2 could be increased to 256 simultaneous voices, because the new Macs will easily handle than and more....

...at 48k.

at 88 or 96k, it's a different story. Voices go quick. 96 voices on 6 DSP's @ 96k, with HEAT and ADC and a few busses, and some TDM-only (or on Aux tracks) plugs, HD-3 Accel gets full QUICK.

Sure, you can RTAS your way in individual channels all night long. But most of my sessions won't open on an HD-2 (and won't open on a HD-3 Accel / G5 now, apparently, either! %@^#!

[garnoil]

Originally Posted by Sean Russell

...at 48k.

at 88 or 96k, it's a different story. Voices go quick. 96 voices on 6 DSP's @ 96k, with HEAT and ADC and a few busses, and some TDM-only (or on Aux tracks) plugs, HD-3 Accel gets full QUICK.

Sure, you can RTAS your way in individual channels all night long. But most of my sessions won't open on an HD-2 (and won't open on a HD-3 Accel / G5 now, apparently, either! %@^#!

Yes, at 48K. In my case to work at 96K I would have to lock another system because the voices are just not enough (for film work which is what I do). I don't care how much TDM processing power I have with 3 cards (accel 3) if all the system can do is 96 voices (assuming 96K). In film work, 96 voices is simply not enough. Most films I do end up using the full 196 voice count (although I sometimes have to print tracks or effects) and that is already a huge limitation. I would like another 196 voices to start and this is at 48K. If I did a film at 96K I would need at least 3 Pro-Tools HD2 just to get the voice count never mind the processing. In my opinion, it won't be long before Avid raises the voice count (or they should). The next Macs will be able to run massive RTAS without sucking the CPU dry. Righ now, on my Mac, I am running about 40% CPU (these are massive sessions) BUT every once in a while there is a bigger spike on the CPU load. I think that the TDM cards are on their way out (I own two of them) but in reality in 3 years from now, the computing power will dictate a new way of managing sound processing.

I am also considering looking at Nunedo as a second system locked to my HD2, just to that I can have unlimited voice count (limited only by the CPU). If the system ups the voice count every time you buy a better computer, the system will always be "more current and upgradable" than if you are locked to x number of voices imposed by the TDM hardware.

[garnoil]

Originally Posted by garnoil

Yes, at 48K. In my case to work at 96K I would have to lock another system because the voices are just not enough (for film work which is what I do). I don't care how much TDM processing power I have with 3 cards (accel 3) if all the system can do is 96 voices (assuming 96K). In film work, 96 voices is simply not enough. Most films I do end up using the full 196 voice count (although I sometimes have to print tracks or effects) and that is already a huge limitation. I would like another 196 voices to start and this is at 48K. If I did a film at 96K I would need at least 3 Pro-Tools HD2 just to get the voice count never mind the processing. In my opinion, it won't be long before Avid raises the voice count (or they should). The next Macs will be able to run massive RTAS without sucking the CPU dry. Righ now, on my Mac, I am running about 40% CPU (these are massive sessions) BUT every once in a while there is a bigger spike on the CPU load. I think that the TDM cards are on their way out (I own two of them) but in reality in 3 years from now, the computing power will dictate a new way of managing sound processing.

I am also considering looking at Nunedo as a second system locked to my HD2, just to that I can have unlimited voice count (limited only by the CPU). If the system ups the voice count every time you buy a better computer, the system will always be "more current and upgradable" than if you are locked to x number of voices imposed by the TDM hardware.

HD2 and HD3 have exactly the same number of voices, all you get is more TDM processing with an HD3