Daisy Chaining = Problematic

[playthemdrums]

To save me reposting my setup and problems you can read them here for background info http://duc.digidesign.com/showthread.php?t=279762

I have basically come to the conclusion that the reason for my buffer errors and DAE errors is due to the fact that I only have one firewire port on my Macbook Pro, and that there is some kind of struggle or conflict going on.

At the moment i have FW800 from MBP --> FW800 Drive (Oxford chip) --> Digi 003+ Rack (using fw400 port on drive)

If i try to record on the FW800 drive mentioned, it works but is unstable.

If i try to record on my system internal disk it works fine.

So i have decided to buy a unibrian or kramer Firewire 800 hub to give me an extra 2 FW800 ports.


Setup will then be; MBP --> FW800 hub -->
----> DIGI 003R+ (w converter)
----> FW800 Drive

What do you guys think of this setup?

Thanks for your time

[audiogeekzine]

I heard firewire hubs are a bad idea

Not sure why it's not working for you though.

[playthemdrums]

Why are they a bad idea?

I've always had problems with it, im considering just buying a new external drive but i don't really want to fork out the $'s when that may not be the fix

Maybe i should just give up and use my system drive then backup to the firewire drive.

Any suggestions?

Btw, Apple did away with the Express card ports on the 15" MBP. I can't connect a Express card with two FW800 ports >:-[

[audiogeekzine]

my mobile system is 2009 13"MBP, Lacie D2 Quadra 1TB and Profire 2626.

Try running the system at 400 speed.
Mac>800-400 cable>interface>drive

I have the belkin cable which works fine but I'd say it's not really 'studio' quality. I now use the one from HOSA which is very beefy.

[playthemdrums]

Wait so you put your interface first? I thought that wasn't recommended.

I believe I tried that with slightly better but not much better results but i'll try again

[The Dougfather]

By placing a FW400 device first on the chain it drops the entire bus to FW400, you may be experiencing problems because your combining FW400 and FW800 togther, although i only recall seeing issue with this on MBox 2 Pro's.

If your external drive doesn't have a firewire FW400 port then you have little choice than to put the drive last in the chain using a FW400 > FW800 converter. The reason it's not recommended is because the 002/003's don't pass data when they're powered down so this can potentially cause data corruption issues.

[tamasdragon]

The proper chaining is computer-drive-interface.
If everything is like recommended (os, pt, and plugin versions), than it is stable.

Firewire hub may work, but not really recommended, because it can complicate things. Remember that with a hub, you actually don't have more bandwith.
Try going through the whole chain with firewire 400. With using one 800to400 cable at the start of the chain.

And be sure that your drive is not sleeping after a few minutes. Check it with the manufacturer, and check your power saving setup too in the os.

[playthemdrums]

I've always had it computer drive interface. MBP FW800 to 800 on Drive. Then FW400 Port to FW400 on Digi003R+.

I have a converter cable and i'll try some different combinations but I have a feeling it's going to be a waste of time. I'm going to look at firewire drives today. I live in NZ and those OWC drives are hard to come by. Hence why I went for the Macpower Taurus 3

Specs of my current drive
Macpower Taurus RAID III Dual Bay Firewire800+USB2.0 RAID 0/1 Hard Drive Enclosure

Specifications:

• Model No.: PDD-FBA3U2OS-R2
• Bridge Chipset: Oxford 924 DSB
• Case Material: High quality aluminium for optimised heat dissipation

Application:
• One or two 3.5" SATA-I or SATA-II Hard Drives (1.5Gb/s)
• 20GB - 1TB (per HDD)
• For RAID 0 & 1, two hard hard drives of identical capacity and make are required

Interface/Ports:
• Firewire 800 (1394b) 2 ports
• Firewire 400 (1394a) 1 port
• USB 2.0 High Speed (USB 1.1 compatible) 1 port

Data Transfer
• Firewire 800 (1394b) up to 800Mbps (100MB/s)
• Firewire 400 (1394a) up to 400Mbps (50MB/s)
• USB 2.0 up to 480Mbps (60MB/s)
• USB 1.1 up to 12Mbps (1.5MB/s)

Features:

• Configurable RAID function for 2 drives (RAID 1 mirroring, RAID 0 striping, JBOD or (non-RAID)
• USB mass-storage compliant (USB 2.0 and USB 1.1)
• Supports Firewire 400 and 800 (hardware acceleration for FastStart & small data blocks)
• 18-Kbyte cache for USB or Firewire data maximizes performance by double-buffering 4-Kbyte packets
• Smart Fan (automatically regulates fan speed according to the internal temperature)

Environment:
• Operating Temperature: 5°C ~ 40°C
• Operating Humidity: 10%RH ~ 80%
• Storage Temperature: -20°C ~ 70°C
• Storage Humidity: 5%RH ~ 90%RH

System Requirements (PC)
• Firewire 800 (1394b): Windows 2000/XP/Vista
• Firewire 400 (1394a): Windows 2000/XP/Vista
• USB 2.0 (USB 1.1): Windows 2000/XP/Vista
• Your hardware device must have the correct corresponding port (eg. USB 2.0, USB 1.1 or PCI card)

System Requirements (Mac)
• Firewire 800 (1394b): Mac OS 10.2 or higher
• Firewire 400 (1394a): Mac OS 10.1.5 or higher
• USB 2.0 (USB 1.1): Mac OS 10.2 or higher
• Your hardware device must have the correct corresponding port (eg. USB 2.0, USB 1.1 or PCI card)

Power Supply
• External Power Adapter universal auto-switching (UL, cUL, CE, TUV approved)
• Input: AC 100-240V
• Output: DC +5V/4.2A +12V/3A

[playthemdrums]

Hi there,
My setup

Brand new Macbook Pro 15" i7 (bought it 10 days ago)
Macpower Taurus 3 FW800 External Hard Drive (running oxford chipset - 2 FW 800 ports, one FW400)
Digi 003+R

I am running the Digi 003 through the FW400 port of the External HD and then FW800 port from drive to the Macbook Pro.

Errors I am getting:
- Increase Hardware Buffer.
- DAE Errors (drive too slow)-
- Running out of CPU
Disk Usage is around 2 - 5 % and CPU (RTAS) usage never goes over 50%

Through all the general trouble shooting, I have come to the conclusion that the errors are due to 1 of 2 reasons;

1)
My external hard drive is either faulty or incompatible

2)
Daisy Chaining is causing problems

I know this because I got BETTER results recording to my 5200 RPM internal drive..

So there are only a couple of fixes

1) I buy a new drive (oxford chipset drives are very difficult to come by in New Zealand - everything is western digital)

2) I try and extend the ports on my macbook pro (there is only one FW800 port) so that the interface has it's own port and the external drive has it's own port. BUT, to do this I have to (essential downgrade as the processor is less powerful) to the 17" model as apple recently ditched the Express card port on the 15"

I don't see how there can be any fault with my drive, or how it is incompatible as it fulfills all the requirements

What do you suggest I do!!! I seriously need some advice here

I have been through all the possible troubleshooting.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

If you want to read more in depth about my system/drive specs and all my trouble shooting check out my previous threads.

[tamasdragon]

That drive seems to be very good, but one question. Do you use it in raid mode? Because pro tools is not supporting any raid config.