tips on How to Mix in the Box!

[jv5080]

Anyone got tips on How to Mix in the Box?

I tried not to record the signals too hot (usually some where in between the green and yellow region of a meter), and tried not to clip the plugins as well.
yes they do help, but what else can be done to make a better mix in the box?

...sugestions on books or instructional DVDs would be nice too!

Thanks

[DAS-Mike]

One thing I LOVE about mixing in the box is that you get perfect total recall. My number one suggestion about learning to MITB is to really have fun and experiment with your mixes. Do many versions and try some super creative things. That creativity, experimentation and fun will usually create a wonderful end result. I realize that this is not a specific answer to your question but hopefully it will spark some ideas.

Mike

[crizdee]

Hi,

Mix it like a record by Charles Dye....

http://www.harddisklife.com/MILAR_Pages/MILAR.html

Chris

[tlester]

1. Don't over do it. With ITB mixing (and recording) we have a tendency to "micro-manage" the mix. We tweak every little thing. It already takes me long to mix digitally than in the analog world, but I'm getting much faster. I'm learning to do as much from my control surface (just a command8) as possible. For example. Grab the panner and automate your move. Get it like you want it and leave it. Don't go into the edit window and proceed to make the curve as perfect as possible. There are times for that, and there are times just to let it go. Over doing it can make it less musical sounding.

2. I highly recommend some sort of analog buss and tape emulator. I use Analog channel. I've heard good things about Phoenix. Whatever you like. Use it generously. Put it on early.

3. Don't over do the 'verbs. I like to pick a few spaces and that's the bases for everything. Anything addition to that is for "star factor" or effect. For example. Let's say I have a typicall 4 piece rock band. If you picture a stage, you usually have drums in the back, guitars a little more toward the audience, bgv's next, then lead vocal out front. I set up the same thing with my reverbs. I bring up 4 aux channels. I pick a room/space (lets say a medium room). I'll put the same medium room on all four aux channels. Then, I'll tweek the pre-delay on each of them. Shortest pre-delay is for the furthest back instruments and the longest pre-delay for the closest. I.e. It may be something like this for a 120bpm song: 16ms drums; 31ms guitars; 62ms BGV's; 125ms Lead Vocals. The reason I mention this, is you have a lot more reverbs that you "can" do than in normal studios. Over using can sound un-natural.

4. Get really well recorded well performed tracks in the first place. It makes all the difference in the world.

-Tom

[PTUser NYC]

jv5080,

You're off to a good start. Keeping your levels correct is an important link in the chain. Now you're up to the aesthetic questions.

One good point is not to make everything sound perfect. The result of that is a sterile sounding track, like the demonstration CD of New Age music that comes with the car stereo - yuck. No, you want a point of view.

Try to remember that nothing is loud until something else is quiet. Nothing is dry until something else is wet. Nothing full sounding until something else is bandpass filtered etc.

Try to look for, and make the most of character in the lead instruments, and keep similar material out of the way in supporting instruments.

The more tracks you have, the smaller each sound may need to be to fit together. Remember that art and psychology is what you're after here. If the bass is thunderous, the guitars can be small and edgy, and still feel "big" thanks to the bass. You'd be amazed at how small those Who guitars really are, compared to your memory of them.

I like some bus compression, and track with some too - others will feel differently. Just aim for a mix that isn't too dynamic if you want to sound professional. Too dynamic depends on the case of course - for some things 2db is too dynamic, for others, 18db is fine. It depends on what you're doing.

Just always try to have a goal in mind when you do something - don't compress a bass because you're supposed to - listen to where you are, and if the bass isn't punching in the right way, use a tool to add that. usually, you have different choices to get to the same end. In the case of the bass, a limiter, some distortion, reamping etc can all add similar effects.

Listen critically to your favorite recordings on the same system you mix on.

Welcome to a LONG artistic road. Good luck!

[jv5080]

Thank you!
You guys have been very generous sharing your knowledge and helpful tips.
Especially PTUserNYC, and tlester.
I'll have your tips handy for my next mix.
and DAS Mike, I guess I'll try to be more creative and see what happens.

oh, one more thing.. PTUserNYC, I'm not sure what you mean by aiming for the mix that's not "too dynamic"?
could you explain what "too dynamic" is?

thanks

[PTUser NYC]

oh, one more thing.. PTUserNYC, I'm not sure what you mean by aiming for the mix that's not "too dynamic"?
could you explain what "too dynamic" is?

Well, dynamic refers to the changes in loudness over time. The biggest 'error' that sets GOOD amatuer mixes apart from more professional ones is a lack of attention to dynamics.

If you are making a modern rock record, and your mix consistently has 10 db between average level and peaks, even if things sound good, you probably haven't made a 'professional' mix.

The trick is getting all the air and image from a tighter mix. OBVIOUSLY this is JUST A GUIDELINE I realize that its very fashionable right now to bitch about mixes with half a db in dynmaic range. Ok I agree that can and does get excessive, but the answer was probably a db or two, not 10.

its interesting to be setting levels around 0dbVU (-18dbFS, maybe) and getting good headroom through your mixer, and then be hitting a little (1 or 2 db) of gain reduction on a compressor across the mix bus before raising the output level until you're just under Full Scale. This stage, the last one, is where you raise the peaks to just under full scale - so your 16 bit dub or CD makes sense.

A lot of times I hit the bus compressor less than 1 db, raise the output to just under full scale, and follw with the L1 set for just a bit of reduction as well. i do this early, so I'm mixing into it.

[badboymusic]

I agree with Crizdee, Mix It Like A Recrd by Charles Dye is an unbelievable resource to learn from. With the DVD you get the Pro Tools session files of a song by the band EL with Grammy winning producer Charles Dye at the helm. You open them in your Pro Tools TDM, LE, Mix, and can hear and see for yourself how Charles Dye mixes a record. You can see what effects he used, settings, etc.. Be prepared though Charles Dye uses a lot of effects and you will need to download trial versions or purchase. But, if you want to learn how to mix in the box and have it sound like a record, this is a must have.

No I don't work for Charles Dye or receive any commission.

[frenchman]

Anyone got tips on How to Mix in the Box?

Check your monitoring environment !
The sound you get in big studios has as much to do with proper monitoring acoustics than with analog bussing...
If what you hear is right you will probably take better mixing decisions !

Listen to a lot of well mixed records on your monitoring system to get the feel of your monitors

Don't insert compressors and limiters on your master fader to early in the mix process, wait until your mix is getting close to the desired result.
Good individual compression on the tracks that need it will yield a tighter mix than when compressing groups of tracks (unless you are after a specific pumpig effect)
The eq you use most will have a dramatic effect ion the overall sound. A good eq plug like Oxford or URS will make your mixes sound MUCH better than by using for example the good ol' Focusrite
good experimenting

[PTUser NYC]

Don't insert compressors and limiters on your master fader to early in the mix process, wait until your mix is getting close to the desired result.

With no disrespect to frenchman, and with an understanding that there are lots of ways to get great results, I have to disagree with this.

I love hearing slight compression on the mix bus as I'm getting levels. I find that hitting that little rubber ceiling is very helpful in matching volumes, and in getting certain moments to poke through without adding a new gain peak into things.

Check this example:

Say there's and important word in the lyric getting buried, or a snare fill that needs to domonate for a moment.

If you mix without bus compression, when you push the vocal or snare, it pokes through just as intended, but the result is a new peak that's louder than the rest. This means the rest of your mix must end up quieter to allow for that one peak.

When you have a compressor on the bus, pushing a track still pokes it out of the mix, but then the compressor grabs it, and brings it back to basically the same place it was before you pushed it - only now, the rest of the track is being ducked a little, so you still get the poking through effect, but the peak is not higher.

In actuality, every track has its little moments, and this technique allows them all to shine through, while everyone else steps back half an inch for just the right moment.

Its very helpful in setting levels too. Let's say you're working on the bass, and you want it loud and prominent, without killing everything around it. You raise the fader until it hits the compressor. When you hear everything else go away, you know you've gone too far. See, if you have the compressor inline, but you hardly hit it, its more of a warning when you're out of line, tha much of an effect, whene everything is tucked correctly, and the compressor isn't doing much.

I like Ren Comp, ratios of 1.2 or even less, and less than 1 db of gain reduction typically, with peaks (always under 3 db) in rare cases. Then i will hit it with the L1 a tiny bit too in many cases.

I like having these things in the whole time. The L1 can sound harsh, but if I made every mix decision listening through it, it becomes part of the sound, rather than a harsh imprint on top of it. If the final result is going to be 16 bit, and not remastered (like an ad for example) I will often turn on the word reduction and dither in the L1 at the beginning of the mix, and make decisions that sound good after going through that process too, so the master mix in my 24 bit session CAN be a 16 bit recording (well, a 24 bit recording, but with 0's in the least significant 8 bits of the word, having been chopped off by the 16 bit conversion in the L1.

For those who feel that that compression is the devil, I do notice that this is my 666th post on this board.

For those who don't believe in such things (like me), its just a lot of advice I've given.