Leopard info

[Delso]

Boy, did I pick the wrong time to order a new Mac!

My old iBook G4 was showing signs of age - DVD drive needed replacing, RAM increase essential, new HD - so I thought I'd cut my losses and buy a 2Ghz/2Gb RAM desktop, load my version of PTLE 7.3 and update it to 7.4.

As an afterthought, I thought I'd check the Leopard compatibility issue - I haven't been in touch here for months. I heard from a friend, who is tight with Apple Europe and Digidesign, that 7 April (today) was indeed 'good news day.'

Guess I'll have to leave my new iMac in its packaging for a month or two.

[stoneinapond]

….I heard from a friend, who is tight with Apple Europe and Digidesign, that 7 April (today) was indeed 'good news day.'

I bet your "tight" friend was just speculating based on McDSP announcing new Leopard upgrades for their plug-ins on April 7th. Well, it's 9.30am Pacific Time and there are no updates posted on the McDSP site as of yet.

However, if you had read the complete thread, you would have noticed a long post from Dave Lebolt stating:

….We hope to have the new release within between 1 and 2 months from now; some of that timetable is contingent on Apple. We'll keep you posted as we get closer….

That was posted on Friday.

[Delso]

OK, stoneinapond,

There's no need for that tone. When I said 'tight' I meant an accredited Apple and Digidesign retailer. He gave me that 'info' just before Dave's announcement.

The reason for my post was that I thought there might be an outside chance that Dave's announcement was just covering Apple in case there was some slippage and that customers could expect the good news earlier than his pessimistic forecast.

I had in fact read the statement elsewhere, which is why I came back here for more insight. My mistake.

[iMartin]

lets hope that 10.5.3 is the version that digi´s people is working on with apple´s engineers.

[jeff markham]

I believe you aren't the only one surprised by the recent
delay. There is a real logjam developing....

jeff

[imcfresh]

Thanks, Dave. I really appreciate this update as I have been scanning the forums for months waiting for news on Leopard support. I have several systems that I would like to upgrade and as a 16 year Digidesign customer I have learned that there is always a waiting period before OS compatibilities are resolved. To me, your update has at the very least explained some of the reasons for your delays. I don't mind waiting if I know how Digidesign is coming along with the updates. However, I would be lying if I said that delays don't, at times, frustrate me. I think part of that comes from spending time on the boards looking for clues on a release only to come up empty handed. For me, it feels like wasted time. So, Thank You for the update. Please keep this part of customer service in mind as you continue to update, expand and develop your products for us.

[nikki-k-again]

Hi!
I have been away from Pro Tools for what feels like forever. After selling my HD rig, going LE "full time" was quite a ride. Such a short list of things LE truly needs for me to be ok.

SO!
The HUGE question I have is: Will Leopard support bring *proper* multi-core/CPU support? "Proper" RTAS implementation/resource usage?

If I can actually use my 002 on my Mac Pro (1st gen 2.66 w/ 4G ram, multiple drives) doing 24/44.1k(48k), 40-45 tracks of audio, mild edits, several well known VI's (BFD2, Ivory, Absynth4, Minimoog, Xpand!, Hybrid, and either Structure or Kontakt and B4II simultaneously) all @ a 128 buffer, 4 core setting WITHOUT having to turn off RTAS errors and be able to have it work properly, AND be able to be saved, closed, and reopened later and STILL work properly... well, I would smile, as it would do what Logic8 is doing without even breaking a sweat currently (I use EXS24 instead of Xpand! and ES2 instead of Hybrid).

I have no delusions that PT will outdo AU's in Logic via RTAS; I just feel it should do at least a third...and be able to utilize all 4 cores properly.

[gibson_sg]

(BFD2, Ivory, Absynth4, Minimoog, Xpand!, Hybrid, and either Structure or Kontakt and B4II simultaneously) all @ a 128 buffer

you being serious? not to hijack the thread but...

I've talked to people that use to work at NI and even they know how horribly unstable their software is, even more so in the RTAS world. Sure, somethings Digi can do better, such as their RTAS implementation, but I don't feel RTAS 'un-performance' is all on them, software developers can write their plug-ins more light weight and more stable. I think its a 2 way road IMO.

[nikki-k-again]

(BFD2, Ivory, Absynth4, Minimoog, Xpand!, Hybrid, and either Structure or Kontakt and B4II simultaneously) all @ a 128 buffer

you being serious? not to hijack the thread but...

I've talked to people that use to work at NI and even they know how horribly unstable their software is, even more so in the RTAS world. Sure, somethings Digi can do better, such as their RTAS implementation, but I don't feel RTAS 'un-performance' is all on them, software developers can write their plug-ins more light weight and more stable. I think its a 2 way road IMO.

Mmm... sort of.
For me, NI has been a bit hit and miss in PT since day one. But, currently, with Logic 8 and NI, all is very nice (so far), especially with Leopard. Although I use a Nord Electro 2 once I go to track, while composing I typically use B4II. I love Absynth 4 for evolving pads and wild leads, but might later sub out a V-Synth GT patch when tracking. Once again, composing is much simpler when relying on VI's only. Since I am doing prog rock (sort of, I guess...), I have live guitars, bass and vocals. Tons of harmonies and such with all the instruments, and then the keys get pretty dense once in awhile. Bottom-line tho: Logic 8 + Leopard + NI stuff I use is fine. B4II gets used ALOT. Kontakt...well, not very much, but occasionally. EXS24 does well enough for most things.

I do agree NI is at fault here. But, I would love to know what 3rd RTAS VI anyone would consider as well written code for RTAS that has an AU equiv. Take that one, and compare performance to AU. Then try to use all 4 cores. I realize 8 core machines are still experiencing growing pains, as is Leopard. But, PT is notorious for multi-core/CPU issues, and even suggest setting to a single core. With Structure and Hybrid, I might be able to get around using NI stuff until they fix their code. But, for tonewheel stuff...well, B4II is it when it comes to PT. Heck, I would even start a composition with piano using a patch in Xpand! vs using Ivory to save resources. But for drums, it is either going to be BFD2, DFHS, or the upcoming S2. PT + firewire + VI's + multi core/cpu = nightmare city.

[Heck]

Pro Tools = Great Product.
Digidesign = Not So Great Company.

I hope Digidesign understands where it needs serious improvements. I refuse to use any other program for making music because Pro Tools, as out dated as the programming is, is simply the best. However, it's not fun putting up with this wait and its expensive. This company has a very bittersweet relationship with its users. Digidesign please don't take us for granted because if Logic or any other DAW was anything close to Pro Tools I would have switched over and never looked back.

Please work harder on this release. Allocate more resources, spend more money, hire better programmers, test faster.
I appreciate the update but this is the real world and people are losing money. As an LE and HD costumer I don't have sympathy for this, I don't want to get letters saying "I'm sorry," this isn't kindergarten, we are paying customers who need and deserve timely results! 1 to 2 months is unacceptable after all this wait.