Cinema Trailer Mix - LEQ?

[Meads]

Did a lot of cinema work in the analogue days, where LEQ for trailers was 85, if I recall correctly.
How is it these days with DCP? Does this reading still count? I need to know, because I have a trailer at hand right now, that needs to be mixed, and I'm not sure about levels.

Thanks!

[Kuba Pietrzak]

I cannot speak about Germany, but here in Poland (not so far I would say ), it is still the same, which is 82 for commercials and 85 for trailers. Also for DCP. There is no difference.

best,
Kuba

[Meads]

Great, thanks for the info!
I do not think, that it's a different cup of tea in Germany.

[thierryd]

in Belgium it's 85 LEQ for commercials and trailers for some time now (DCP and now vanished 35mm).
It used to be 82 LEQ for commercials until about 2 years ago.

Greetings,

Thierry

[Frank Kruse]

Originally Posted by Kuba Pietrzak

I cannot speak about Germany, but here in Poland (not so far I would say ), it is still the same, which is 82 for commercials and 85 for trailers. Also for DCP. There is no difference.

best,
Kuba

Unfortunately Germany has the same insanely high standard for trailers and commercials. The main reason why theaters turn down the level before every screening.

[Mubeau]

Hi!

I mix a trailer. All fine. then I analysed LEQ(m)
and I went 78leq(m).
How the hell should I EVER reach 85??? This is painfully loud!

SO DO I REALLY HAVE TO LOWER MY Playback VOLUME?
What do Reference you use??? Votes welcome :).

Yes I read and searched the forum.
Yes, my room is calibrated and I did 2 Mixes here which have also been checked at a mixing stage and played back well in cinema.

Thanks a Lot!!
Mubeau

[matt-o-]

Originally Posted by Mubeau

How the hell should I EVER reach 85??? This is painfully loud!

No one with healthy ears is able to mix to 85LEQ with Dolby Volume set to 7. You have to pull the Volume down to 4, as is done in the cinemas. What a stupid reference!

The most horrible thing is, that you have to push it up to 85LEQ, otherwise it will be almost mute in comparison with the other stuff...

That's why I reject commercial/trailer mixes principally.

[Mubeau]

Thanks!!!

1. 85 LEQm is the whole file average, not short term. right?

2. So that around 10dB (9.9) minus... from 7 to 4? Am I right?

3. Do most cinemas go down to 4 or 5 for trailers?

4. Do they really change between trailers and commercials?

5. Film playback is 6 ... as some of my collegues mention?

I know this has been discussed quite a lot but i try to summ this up for my
humble head ....

Cheers,
Mubeau

[matt-o-]

Originally Posted by Mubeau

Thanks!!!

1. 85 LEQm is the whole file average, not short term. right?

2. So that around 10dB (9.9) minus... from 7 to 4? Am I right?

3. Do most cinemas go down to 4 or 5 for trailers?

4. Do they really change between trailers and commercials?

5. Film playback is 6 ... as some of my collegues mention?

I know this has been discussed quite a lot but i try to summ this up for my
humble head ....

Cheers,
Mubeau

1. yes
2. approximately, yes
3. from experience: yes, but worse, very often they do not re-adjust back to 6 or 7 after the commercials
4. no, the LEQ difference was meant to compensate for (purely fictional) dynamic differences between trailers and commercials
5. film playback is anything between 4 and 7, depending on the good will or interest from the projectionist...

that's how sad it looks... though there are projectionists who care for proper level, even check every movie and choose the best playback level (from their taste) ;-)

Greetings,
Matthias

[Meads]

Originally Posted by matt-o-

5. film playback is anything between 4 and 7, depending on the good will or interest from the projectionist...

The problem to begin with being features mixed at levels below 7 to compensate for smaller room size of the mixing stage or whatever other reasons, more often than not resulting in unbearable loudness at a listening level of 7.

Also, there's the matter of taste. Where person A complains to the theater that a movie has been played too hot, person B will complain, that he didn't feel his seat trembling during those fight scenes - and that's what he pays for, when he buys a ticket.
The whole principle is flawed, because it's a compromise at best, that is based on perception which isn't a great measure.
Projectionists changing the playback level to taste doesn't really make it worse, imho. It just changes the threshold of the line between people who think it's too low and those who think it's too hot.

Just saying. I don't have a better idea or anything, and this topic has been discussed at length over and over again.