Pro Tools 10.3.7 Hard Freeze Computer Randomly

[pettah93]

Hey everybody!

I am new to this forum and it looks like a great community for Avid users, so I decided to join!
(Sorry for this huge post, but I wanted to give you as much information as I can)

I have a problem with my Pro Tools 10.3.7 software. When I am running the program it sometimes, and sometimes quite often, hard crash my entire computer, and it seems to happen randomly. The whole computer freezes and the only way to go about it is to do a hard shutdown, and hopefully I saved recently enough in my Pro Tools session. This suffers my workflow immensly and I don´t know what to do about it!

I have searched the forums for a solution to my problems, I have found similar problems, but not anything like this exactly so I think it can be posted as a new thread like this.

I figure you want as much information possible to easier be able to help finding a solution, so here we go:

-For computer specs look at the Sandra report

-Pro Tools 10.3.7

-Mbox 3

-Seems completely random: First I thought it was when I had a video in the session, but it is occuring without aswell. I thought it could be because I was running an OMF, but it happens without that aswell.
Sometimes it occurs when I playback my session, sometimes it occurs when I change settings in a plug in, open a plugin. Sometimes when I click a random button, shortcut, moving my mouse etc. It is to my eyes occuring completely random.

-It probably is not a "lack of RAM" issue since it happens just as much in small sessions with maybe 1 d-verb plug loaded as in larger sessions with many plugins, OMF, video etc.

-I have tried different HW buffer sizes, delay compensations, CPU limit etc.

-I have tried deleting PT prefs, and I still do after each crash.

-I have tried reinstall PT several times. I even reinstalled my OS. (I have tried switching between Win7 and 8 aswell)

-System usage shows really low values so I can´t understand why this is happening!

-I have tried to reinstall Mbox drivers aswell.

-One really interesting (and annoying) part is that this problem have occured in PT 10.3.7 on two different computers, so something must really be wrong. I don´t have access to the second computer right now, but I will post a Sandra Report for that second computer later aswell!

Thank you so much for trying to help! It is very much appreciated because I really need to solve this!

--------------------------------------------------
SiSoftware Sandra

ID
Host Name : Petter-PC
Workgroup : WORKGROUP

Computer
Model : OEM Maximus Formula
Serial Number : System Ser**********
Chassis : Desktop
Mainboard : ASUS Maximus Formula
Serial Number : MS1C7AB********
BIOS : AMI (OEM) 1302 11/28/2008
Total Memory : 4GB DIMM DDR2

Processors
Processor : Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU E8400 @ 3.00GHz (2C 3GHz, 6MB L2)
Socket/Slot : FC LGA775

Chipset
Memory Controller : ASUS X38 Processor to I/O Controller 4x 334MHz (1.34GHz), 2x 2GB DIMM DDR2 802MHz 128-bit

Memory Module(s)
Memory Module : Corsair CM2X2048-8500C5D 2GB DIMM DDR2 PC2-8500U DDR2-1066 (5-5-5-18 3-23-6-3)
Memory Module : Corsair CM2X2048-8500C5D 2GB DIMM DDR2 PC2-8500U DDR2-1066 (5-5-5-18 3-23-6-3)

Video System
Monitor/Panel : LG L227W
(1680x1050, 22.0")
Monitor/Panel : LG W2452
(1920x1200, 30.6")
Video Adapter : ATI Radeon HD 5800 Series (1600 SM5.0 850MHz, 1GB DDR5 4.8GHz 256-bit, PCIe 2.00 x16)
Video Adapter : ATI Radeon HD 5800 Series (1600 SM5.0 850MHz, 1GB DDR5 4.8GHz 256-bit, PCIe 2.00 x16)

Graphics Processor
Compute Shader Processor : ATI Radeon HD 5800 Series (1600SP 850MHz, 1GB DDR5 4.8GHz 256-bit)

Storage Devices
Maxtor 6L200M0 (203.9GB, SATA150, 8MB Cache) : 190GB (C:)
SAMSUNG HD403LJ (400.1GB, SATA300, 3.5", 7200rpm, 16MB Cache) : 373GB (D:)
TSSTcorpCD/DVDW SH-S183A (SATA150, DVD+-RW, CD-RW, 2MB Cache) : N/A (E:)

Logical Storage Devices
Hard Disk (C:) : 190GB (NTFS) @ Maxtor 6L200M0 (203.9GB, SATA150, 8MB Cache)
System Reserved : 100MB (NTFS)
Hard Disk (D:) : 373GB (NTFS) @ SAMSUNG HD403LJ (400.1GB, SATA300, 3.5", 7200rpm, 16MB Cache)
Floppy Disk (A:) : N/A
Optical Drive (E:) : N/A @ TSSTcorpCD/DVDW SH-S183A (SATA150, DVD+-RW, CD-RW, 2MB Cache)

Peripherals
LPC Hub Controller 1 : ASUS (ICH9) LPC Interface Controller
LPC Legacy Controller 1 : Winbond W83627DHG
Audio Device : ASUS (ICH9) HD Audio Controller
Audio Device : Pine Technology Cypress HDMI Audio [Radeon HD 5800 Series]
Disk Controller : ASUS (ICH9) 4 port Serial ATA Storage Controller 1
Disk Controller : ASUS (ICH9) 2 port Serial ATA Storage Controller 2
Disk Controller : ASUS JMB368 IDE Controller
USB Controller 1 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 2 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 3 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 4 : ASUS (ICH9) USB2 Enhanced Host Controller
USB Controller 5 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 6 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 7 : ASUS (ICH9) USB Universal Host Controller
USB Controller 8 : ASUS (ICH9) USB2 Enhanced Host Controller
FireWire/1394 Controller 1 : ASUS VIA VT6308 1394 OHCI Controller
SMBus/i2c Controller 1 : Intel ICH SMBus

Printers and Faxes
Printer : Microsoft XPS Document Writer (600x600, Colour)
Fax : Microsoft Shared Fax Driver (200x200)

Network Services
Network Adapter : Marvell Yukon 88E8056 PCI-E Gigabit Ethernet Controller (Ethernet, 1Gbps)
Network Adapter : Marvell Yukon 88E8056 PCI-E Gigabit Ethernet Controller #2 (Ethernet)

Operating System
Windows System : Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate 6.01.7601 (Service Pack 1)
Platform Compliance : x64

Windows Experience Index
Current System : 5.3

[stevecaboose]

Ive got the same problem as you and I don't know how to fix it. It seems that its only an issue with Pro Tools 10.x. I have PT11 installed on my computer also and I have yet to see my computer completely freeze. I cant use PT10 in my recording session because I don't want the computer to freeze in the middle of a session and lose my work. Let me know if you ever get this fixed. Thanks.

[Darryl Ramm]

pettah93:

Thanks for the Sandra report, but the original description here is confusing.

Does Windows appear to temporarily hang or does it crash? If it crashes what is the bluescreen error? If it is hanging is it all of Windows/other apps or is it just Pro Tools? What exactly are you doing to determine this? What happens if you do a CTRL-ALT-DEL when the computer appears hung, if the task manager appears what are the top runnign processes?

What troubleshooting steps have been tried?

Is the system fully optimized, every last thing done?

What antivirus software do you have installed? Is it fully disabled. May end up uninstalling it all if you still have problems.

Although I'd suspect it is Pro Tools causing this, be sure no other apps or background crapware is running. Clean as much of that off your PC as possible.

What is showing up in the Windows Event Viewer? Anything interesting looking around the time of these hangs or any other interesting looking errors?

Uncheck ignore errors in the Pro Tools playback engine dialog and see if any errors are thrown.

What disk partitions are used for VI sample files, audio/session files etc.

What Mbox 3 (standard mini or pro?). What exact version of the Mbox 3 driver is installed?

Are all your plugins installed on your PC up to date? Check really carefully.

Does this happen with a new empty session? If so then try moving all the plugin files our of their folders and see if this happens to Pro Tools with no plugins loaded (yes plugins loaded but not instantiated can cause all sorts of problems).

If it does not happen in an empty session. What plugins are invoked in a session it happens with. Try disabling them.

Create a new Windows account and try testing a new empty session from there and see if that works better. Try one of the old sessions as well.

Your computer has a Via firewire adapter. What is connected to this? Via firewire chipsets can be problematic with audio interfaced (say if you have an Mbox 3 Pro not a standard Mbox), but not normally with this type of problem.

Do you have any other things connected like control surfaces? Unplug all the USB and Firewire devices you can for now.

Post that other Sandra report, and try to think about what is common between the two different computers besides 10.3.7? What third party plugins are installed on both? The exact same interfaced used? Exact same driver version? Did you clone disks installs or anything else common?

I also want to make sure you are not trying to have Pro Tools 11 and Pro Tools 10 running at the same time. Right?

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by stevecaboose

Ive got the same problem as you and I don't know how to fix it. It seems that its only an issue with Pro Tools 10.x. I have PT11 installed on my computer also and I have yet to see my computer completely freeze. I cant use PT10 in my recording session because I don't want the computer to freeze in the middle of a session and lose my work. Let me know if you ever get this fixed. Thanks.

How do you possibly know you have the same problem? I can't even understand clearly between both posts here whether Pro Tools and/or other apps or the whole computer is hanging.

Nobody is going to let you know whether "this" is fixed. It's not clear yet where the problem is here, and if there is a bug, if it in Pro Tools or not. Your best thing is to just follow this and any similar threads. And even better start your own thread for your specific problem.

Start at the "Help us Help You - READ THIS Before Posting!" link on this page above. Make sure you have a compatible OS/Pro Tools/driver versions installed and that you have fully optimized your PC following the instruction under the link above (and in your Pro Tools install documentation). Then if you want help here, start by posting a Sandra report, and details on the exact version of the driver and Pro Tools. And what interface (make/model/version) you are using. Please start a new thread unless you see some very specific thing common here. It just becomes a complete mess with multiple people posting info to the same thread. Nebulous issues with things (apps or whole computer?) hanging or crashing are fairly common and I would not start by assuming you have the same problem as another fairly post.

[pettah93]

Thank you so much for your help Darryl! It means a lot.

Sorry for not being clear enough. The whole computer freezes. I can´t move my mouse, everyting is frozen and nothing happens with controls like ctrl alt delete. I have left this on for a long time and it does not "unfreeze". The only way of getting out of it is by holding down the power button.

I have now went through optimizing my computer and I have done almost all of the general troubleshooting. After I did that I tried to open one of the sessions that I have had problems with, and so far so good!

The problem do occur at quite random times though, sometimes it´s just 3 minutes in and really frequent, sometimes it takes days for it to happen again. So I will have to give it some time before I know if it is fixed!

I will post here again as soon as/if it happens again.





Now for all the other questions!



-My computer is clean of all "crapware" I can find.

-I don´t use any anti virus programs just because I don´t want it to interfere with PT.

-I haven´t yet checked the Event Viewer, but I will do that if this happens again. Maybe that can give me a clue of what is wrong.

-ignore errors is unchecked, no error is showing, it just hangs!

-I am using the D partition for all my VI´s, plugins, projects, and all the audio that I work with!

-I am running with a Mbox 3 standard. with the newest driver installed. 1.1.8

-My plugins are up to date!

-This have not yet to happen in a completely empty session, though it has happened when I am not using any plugins what so ever. (only clean audio tracks)

-I have not yet created a new user, but I will try that if this occurs again, both new and old sessions.

-I don´t have anything connected to the firewire.

- I have a wireless keyboard, which has a USB adapter. maybe this is messing with PT?

-I will post my other computers Sandra report as soon as I get access to that computer.

-I am not trying to run PT10 and PT11 at the same time, but both programs are installed on the computer. I have tried only having PT10 installed before and it happened then aswell!




Hopefully it was something I had missed before when it comes to optimization and troubleshooting and that that simple thing fixed it all!

Thanks again for your help!

Regard,
Petter

[Atlantida]

You should try out Prime95. Run a blend test over night and see if it turns up any errors. Check your CPU temp and voltage rails, 3.3, 5, and 12 volts. It's the best way to rule out faulty hardware. There's also a good chance you're running out of ram. Computer becomes slow, unresponsive, and freezes are all symptoms when using demanding app.'s. Try increasing your page file (virtual memory).

There's also an update for your bios. Thought you should know.

[pettah93]

Update:

Now it froze again! This time it occured when I tried to open a template I have recently created. That template was created from a session that have had theese problems.

Good news though, I checked the event viewer and found some interesting stuff! I don´t know exactly what to look for so I will just post everything I find!

In order:

These 3 information events comes first (all marked as information)


"A request to disable the Desktop Window Manager was made by process (Pro Tools Application)"

"The Desktop Window Manager was unable to start because composition was disabled by a running application"

"A request to disable the Desktop Window Manager was made by process (Mbox Driver Interface)"



Then theese errors come: All marked as Event ID 33, and source "SideBySide"




"Activation context generation failed for "c:\Program Files (x86)\Avid\Pro Tools\DAE\Controllers\003_Resource404.dll". Dependent Assembly Microsoft.VC80.DebugCRT,processorArchitecture="x86 ",publicKeyToken="1fc8b3b9a1e18e3b",type="win32",v ersion="8.0.50727.6195" could not be found. Please use sxstrace.exe for detailed diagnosis"


"Activation context generation failed for "c:\Program Files (x86)\Avid\Pro Tools\DAE\Controllers\003_Resource412.dll". Dependent Assembly Microsoft.VC80.DebugCRT,processorArchitecture="x86 ",publicKeyToken="1fc8b3b9a1e18e3b",type="win32",v ersion="8.0.50727.6195" could not be found. Please use sxstrace.exe for detailed diagnosis"


"Activation context generation failed for "c:\Program Files (x86)\Avid\Pro Tools\DAE\Controllers\003_Resource804.dll". Dependent Assembly Microsoft.VC80.DebugCRT,processorArchitecture="x86 ",publicKeyToken="1fc8b3b9a1e18e3b",type="win32",v ersion="8.0.50727.6195" could not be found. Please use sxstrace.exe for detailed diagnosis."


"Activation context generation failed for "c:\Program Files (x86)\Avid\Pro Tools\DAE\Controllers\D-Control_Resource404.dll". Dependent Assembly Microsoft.VC80.DebugCRT,processorArchitecture="x86 ",publicKeyToken="1fc8b3b9a1e18e3b",type="win32",v ersion="8.0.50727.6195" could not be found. Please use sxstrace.exe for detailed diagnosis."


"Activation context generation failed for "c:\Program Files (x86)\Avid\Pro Tools\DAE\Controllers\D-Control_Resource412.dll". Dependent Assembly Microsoft.VC80.DebugCRT,processorArchitecture="x86 ",publicKeyToken="1fc8b3b9a1e18e3b",type="win32",v ersion="8.0.50727.6195" could not be found. Please use sxstrace.exe for detailed diagnosis."


"Activation context generation failed for "c:\Program Files (x86)\Avid\Pro Tools\DAE\Controllers\D-Control_Resource804.dll". Dependent Assembly Microsoft.VC80.DebugCRT,processorArchitecture="x86 ",publicKeyToken="1fc8b3b9a1e18e3b",type="win32",v ersion="8.0.50727.6195" could not be found. Please use sxstrace.exe for detailed diagnosis."




After this we have some odd information events again:





"The Software Protection service has stopped."


"The Desktop Window Manager was unable to start because composition was disabled by a running application"




And then this event repeats:

"A request to disable the Desktop Window Manager was made by process (Mbox Driver Interface)"


All the same errors (Event ID 33, and source "SideBySide") repeats and it seems like this is were it freezes.



"The EventSystem sub system is suppressing duplicate event log entries for a duration of 86400 seconds. The suppression timeout can be controlled by a REG_DWORD value named SuppressDuplicateDuration under the following registry key: HKLM\Software\Microsoft\EventSystem\EventLog."

This message shows after, I have no idea if it is of any use to us!

[pettah93]

Originally Posted by Atlantida

You should try out Prime95. Run a blend test over night and see if it turns up any errors. Check your CPU temp and voltage rails, 3.3, 5, and 12 volts. It's the best way to rule out faulty hardware. There's also a good chance you're running out of ram. Computer becomes slow, unresponsive, and freezes are all symptoms when using demanding app.'s. Try increasing your page file (virtual memory).

There's also an update for your bios. Thought you should know.

Thanks for your advice, I will try that after we get theese "Windows Event Viewer" errors sorted out.




@ Darryl: I can find this chain of error´s in many places in my windows event viewer, so it seems like that is what is behind this freezes.

[Atlantida]

You know how to get into your services window? It's in control panel/ admin tools/ services. Desktop Window Manager is in there and should be set to Auto startup, and U can force start it there also. Re-open the session after and see what happens.

Also try right click on your desktop, then personalize, then click on the Change Desktop icons, then check Allow themes to change desktop icons. It's a shot in the dark. Oh and make sure to run protools as an admin. If that all fails, try this in command 'sfc /scannow'. It scans the integrity of all protected Windows 7 system files and replaces incorrect corrupted, changed/modified, or damaged versions with the correct versions if possible.

[Darryl Ramm]

Ah Guys, be careful assuming there errors mean anything for sure. the SxS/DLL errrors probalby don't mean anything is wrong.

These errors are "Side by Side" of "SxS" errors, the part of Windows that supports multiple conflicting shared libraries aka DLLs (dynamic link Libraries). An applciation tries to open a shared library and the SxS system maps many potential versions of the library to the one needed.

The errors in the message above are from Pro Tools trying to load the x86 (ie.. 32 bit versions, as expected for Pro Tools 10) of a DLL for the old Digidesign 003 interface and for the old ProControl control surface/console. Neither of which I suspect you have. And from the names of those DLLs it is obvious that Pro Tools is trying to open debug versions of those DLLs. Not unusual to try to open a debug DLL, finds they are not there and then opens the standard non-debug version. Still its kind of bad form to have an application spew errors like this if things are OK.

I don't have an equivalent system here to check but I'm pretty sure you'll see those errors on a healthy system.

-----

So the real question is ignoring these SxS DLL errors was there anything else in the event log that could be interesting?

I suggested an awful long list of things before. Double check over that list very carefully (and for example notice I asked about deleting preferences and databases and only got an answer for preferences). Go over all this very carefully. Especially the fill systems optimization.. which will cover things like no antivirus software (that includes Microsoft's stuff), disabling power management, running as Administrator (which is **not** the same as being an administrator user when you run Pro Tools). Do all this ultra carefully--which I don't think you have, if there are composition messages in the event log it looks like you have not disabled composition. Seriously get this system set up properly.

Darryl