Instrument Track Commit results in huge audio delay

[Carl Lie]

Originally Posted by XJENSEN

Euhm, first of all, there are no active plugins in this session. Secondly, based on your comment, I don't think you understand the sense of the Commit feature. This feature is exactly meant to commit tracks *having* plugins on them, to free up processing resources or for easier session sharing. Please refer to page 939 of the Protools 12.7 manual if you like to learn more about the commit, freeze and bounce functionality.

For a guy that needs help you have a bit of an attitude. Maybe lose that and people will want to help more.

C

[metalmixer]

Originally Posted by XJENSEN

Euhm, first of all, there are no active plugins in this session. Secondly, based on your comment, I don't think you understand the sense of the Commit feature. This feature is exactly meant to commit tracks *having* plugins on them, to free up processing resources or for easier session sharing. Please refer to page 939 of the Protools 12.7 manual if you like to learn more about the commit, freeze and bounce functionality.

Plug ins cause delays....
So deactivate the plugins one by one and see which ones are causing the problem
maybe you have a plugin that is not updated that is reporting incorrect delays
I have committed hundreds of tracks and even using plugins with outboard - Track commit has been 100% sample accurate for me

[lesbrunn]

Originally Posted by metalmixer

Plug ins cause delays....
So deactivate the plugins one by one and see which ones are causing the problem
maybe you have a plugin that is not updated that is reporting incorrect delays
I have committed hundreds of tracks and even using plugins with outboard - Track commit has been 100% sample accurate for me

Commit doesn't always work well. Most times it does, but it sometimes sometimes commits earlier than the beat. But I believe the OP is talking about committing external instruments. Does that also work 100% for you? It doesn't, for me.

[XJENSEN]

Originally Posted by Carl Lie

For a guy that needs help you have a bit of an attitude. Maybe lose that and people will want to help more.

Sorry if I sounded overly blunt in my response. I must have developed this 'attitude' while working with Avid products and I shouldn't have replied that late in the evening when I'm stressed out after a day of having to use Protools..

So, metalmixer, thanks for trying to help out! You are in fact completely right that a misbehaving plugin in the session could be responsible for this behavior. However, no (active) plugins were present in this session. I will try to do further troubleshooting later today and, just to be sure, actually remove every single plugin from their slots before I give Commit another go. Fingers crossed!

[Southsidemusic]

Try doing this with all plugins deactivated instead of removing them from the session first and see if that changes anything. Here is how to:

To load a session with plug-ins inactive, use the “Open Session” command (or hit command+O [Mac]/control+O [Windows]). Select the session you would like to open, then hold the shift key while clicking the “Open” button. You could also hold the shift key while double-clicking on the session you want to open, or select the desired session, then hold the shift key while hitting the return key to select “Open.”

Originally Posted by XJENSEN

Sorry if I sounded overly blunt in my response. I must have developed this 'attitude' while working with Avid products and I shouldn't have replied that late in the evening when I'm stressed out after a day of having to use Protools..

So, metalmixer, thanks for trying to help out! You are in fact completely right that a misbehaving plugin in the session could be responsible for this behavior. However, no (active) plugins were present in this session. I will try to do further troubleshooting later today and, just to be sure, actually remove every single plugin from their slots before I give Commit another go. Fingers crossed!

[XJENSEN]

This afternoon, I had contact with Alicja Goliane from Avid, who is investigating the issue, which I have reported as case 03120087. I'll just post here what I have updated the case with a few minutes ago:

Before I started, I trashed PT preferences and also I started from a completely blank project in PT HD 12.7. There are no plugins on the session, LLM and Delay Compensation are enabled. In I/O setup, both Compensate for input/output delays after record pass are enabled. The buffer size is on 128 samples. I have then tried the following:

1. Sending MIDI -> (external) Nord E5D -> Audio results in around 350 samples latency on the recorded audio. Blue mode makes no difference.
2. Sending Instrument Track MIDI -> (external) Nord E5D -> Audio results in around 350 samples latency on the recorded audio. Blue mode makes no difference.
2. Sending Instrument Track MIDI -> (external) Nord E5D -> Instrument Track Commit in Online mode results in around results in around 4600 samples (!!!) latency on the recorded audio. Blue mode is unavailable in this context.

As you see, in ALL of the scenarios above, the ADC does not work. This confirms that neither regular bouncing to disk nor committing works properly in Protools. In my view, this is a very, very serious issue.

[The Weed]

What happens if you turn LLM off?

[del cosmos]

Originally Posted by XJENSEN

This afternoon, I had contact with Alicja Goliane from Avid, who is investigating the issue, which I have reported as case 03120087. I'll just post here what I have updated the case with a few minutes ago:



Before I started, I trashed PT preferences and also I started from a completely blank project in PT HD 12.7. There are no plugins on the session, LLM and Delay Compensation are enabled. In I/O setup, both Compensate for input/output delays after record pass are enabled. The buffer size is on 128 samples. I have then tried the following:



1. Sending MIDI -> (external) Nord E5D -> Audio results in around 350 samples latency on the recorded audio. Blue mode makes no difference.

2. Sending Instrument Track MIDI -> (external) Nord E5D -> Audio results in around 350 samples latency on the recorded audio. Blue mode makes no difference.

2. Sending Instrument Track MIDI -> (external) Nord E5D -> Instrument Track Commit in Online mode results in around results in around 4600 samples (!!!) latency on the recorded audio. Blue mode is unavailable in this context.



As you see, in ALL of the scenarios above, the ADC does not work. This confirms that neither regular bouncing to disk nor committing works properly in Protools. In my view, this is a very, very serious issue.

I can hear you!

But this problem has always been present in Protools.

Most DAWs have automatic delay compensation on their midi playback, Protools don't.

Every time I use an EXTERNAL synth, if I sequence it on Protools, It will always play back out of sync against your recorded audio, even more if you use plug ins in your session.

Avid knows about this, and their solution to this problem was the "midi offset" preference which you can set per instrument or globally.

This is a PITA because that number will vary depending on which plug ins you have on your session.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[lesbrunn]

Originally Posted by del cosmos

I can hear you!

But this problem has always been present in Protools.

Most DAWs have automatic delay compensation on their midi playback, Protools don't.

Every time I use an EXTERNAL synth, if I sequence it on Protools, It will always play back out of sync against your recorded audio, even more if you use plug ins in your session.

Avid knows about this, and their solution to this problem was the "midi offset" preference which you can set per instrument or globally.

This is a PITA because that number will vary depending on which plug ins you have on your session.

Exactly. One would expect HD to compensate for external delays even if Vanilla doesn't, but apparently even this is too much to ask. It becomes worse when you use more than one external synth or sound module, because then they would have different delays, and the global offset wouldn't work. You'd have to compensate manually per track.

[ChuckS]

This is probably related to the MIDI Thru problem with external where MIDI Thru is being compensated by some value related to audio buffer size. So the larger the audio buffer, the greater the offset. This indicates some basic misunderstanding on the developers part of the way PT should handle external instruments vs VIs. There are a couple of threads around regarding this and IMO it's a bug.