Pro Tools 2023.3 - Major delay compensation bug [PT-301415]

[Eric Lambert]

Originally Posted by basharar1

Bug is still in 23.6, Avid has been busy adding marker tricks and colors, because that is what the marketing department needs. Video engine is still intel and super buggy.

I've switched to using DNxHD files and all video engine error woes have evaporated. It's not a fix for PT the app, but it's a fix for my workflow. I'd prefer a truly native video engine but with so many people still using PT Rosetta I suppose this is a roadblock (albeit a small one) for the engine's advancement.

[basehead617]

Back to using external video devices like the old days :)

[Eric Lambert]

Originally Posted by basehead617

Back to using external video devices like the old days :)

Oh lord no. I actually threw away my ancient firewire video box last week and it felt awfully cathartic.

[basharar1]

I am still getting the red delay alert whenever I use certain plug ins like sooth or gulfoss...The delay compensation was working perfectly in silicon beta before 2023.3 and 2023.6. EVEN DEVELOPERS admitted amazement and disapointment at how avid manages to break down protools with every update. The company needs to get its priorities straight, bugs over gimmicks......

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by basharar1

I am still getting the red delay alert whenever I use certain plug ins like sooth or gulfoss...The delay compensation was working perfectly in silicon beta before 2023.3 and 2023.6. EVEN DEVELOPERS admitted amazement and disapointment at how avid manages to break down protools with every update. The company needs to get its priorities straight, bugs over gimmicks......

You are talking about long delay comp numbers caused by plugins on a master fader and the master fader track delay comp going red?

Well first you have a trivial work around... is that working for you?

Avid clearly tried to correct stuff here, I can build simple plugin chains with long delay that go red on a master fader in 2023.3 and do not do that in 2023.6. Like test in a two track (one audio, one master fader) test session... try that yourself. Clearly Avid tried to fix what they did with master fader delay comp in 2023.3. If they did not fix it for you I would suggest you file a support case with Avid and provide them as much info as you can.

What exact latencies are these plugins reporting? Gulfoss Master claims 20ms latency that's only 882 samples at 44.1kHz. No idea about Sooth and Sooth2 and their documentation sucks. But do you see the proper latency expected? And this is only on your master faders? How is it causing you problems? What else are you doing that is causing high latency anywhere?

[gives]

Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm

Sigh.

This *terrible horrible bug* has been fixed in 2023.6. It's documented in the release notes if you know the bug numbers (Avid you need to write more human readable release notes, because uh your customers are human and don't carry around bug numbers in their heads. And you don't provide an index of bug numbers to customers.).

Never mind this "bug" has a trivial work around, and is all so clearly described just a few posts prior in this thread.

Meanwhile well known/well reported hardware insert and LLM and ignore errors record latency and latency compensation bugs remain unfixed.... (yes they have work arounds as well, but still this crap has been going on for tool long).

Agreed..WAY too long.

G

[basharar1]

I have been using the same exact template for the past year, I never had any delay compensation issues before 23.3 FINAL and 23.6, 23.3beta "native and Rosetta" worked. Its not even the master fader, whenever I use 4-5 plug ins that require buffer protools goes red, sooth, spiff, gulfoss among others...my workaround is to render tracks for now, and push my lazy Bm to to learn Nuendo.....

Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm

You are talking about long delay comp numbers caused by plugins on a master fader and the master fader track delay comp going red?

Well first you have a trivial work around... is that working for you?

Avid clearly tried to correct stuff here, I can build simple plugin chains with long delay that go red on a master fader in 2023.3 and do not do that in 2023.6. Like test in a two track (one audio, one master fader) test session... try that yourself. Clearly Avid tried to fix what they did with master fader delay comp in 2023.3. If they did not fix it for you I would suggest you file a support case with Avid and provide them as much info as you can.

What exact latencies are these plugins reporting? Gulfoss Master claims 20ms latency that's only 882 samples at 44.1kHz. No idea about Sooth and Sooth2 and their documentation sucks. But do you see the proper latency expected? And this is only on your master faders? How is it causing you problems? What else are you doing that is causing high latency anywhere?

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by basharar1

I have been using the same exact template for the past year, I never had any delay compensation issues before 23.3 FINAL and 23.6, 23.3beta "native and Rosetta" worked. Its not even the master fader, whenever I use 4-5 plug ins that require buffer protools goes red, sooth, spiff, gulfoss among others...my workaround is to render tracks for now, and push my lazy Bm to to learn Nuendo.....

Yes but you are wasting your time here since you are *clearly* having some problem that has nothing to do with the thread you are posting on - all about Bug 301415 in 2023.3 which was pretty quickly filed as a bug by users, documented, escalated, worked on and closed in 2023.6. And *if* you had an issue caused by that bug you could have worked around it with a mouse click or two, as clearly documented in this thread. But you don't have that problem and the work around is irrelevent. But wether you never had it before or not. It's nothing to do with the issue in this thread which is very well spelt out and all about the master fader delay comp Avid turned on in 2023.3 and turned off in 2023.6. You need to troubleshoot as much as you can, open a support case, and start a different thread on DUC.

Often effective ADC troubleshooting starts by sketching out your signal flow, hand calculating the expected plugin latency for the problematic signal chain(s), and comparing that to what Pro Tools ADC is telling you. Often to find routing problems, or the occasional broken plugin maybe reporting bogus latencies. Or sometimes it's a genuine just exceeding the latency range, change the sample rate, or change some setting in a critical plugin that increases latency. If you have sends and LLM enabled or H/W inserts and LLM enabled there are bugs (or one related bug) I and others have posted about that add bogus several thousand samples of latencies. Test by disabling LLM if you are running native. That bug will also cause horrendous misalignment.

[irispill]

Hello, Not sure if this is the correct thread but I am having issues with delay comp just trying to run a parallel 1176 on a vocal via a bus send and Aux return. This is all native with Hybrid Engine turned off. If I deactivate all plugs on the parallel track it is ok - not great but maybe useable. but with any plugin even AVID trim I am getting phasing. Is there something that has to happen to make this work with HDX?

This a medium sized 24/48 session that ran perfectly on PT12 HD Native.

Current system = 7,1 2019 Mac Pro / 384G Ram, 2TB NVMe System, Session and Library drives. PT 2023.9 / HDX1 / HD i/o / UAD Octo Card.

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by irispill

Hello, Not sure if this is the correct thread but I am having issues with delay comp just trying to run a parallel 1176 on a vocal via a bus send and Aux return. This is all native with Hybrid Engine turned off. If I deactivate all plugs on the parallel track it is ok - not great but maybe useable. but with any plugin even AVID trim I am getting phasing. Is there something that has to happen to make this work with HDX?

This a medium sized 24/48 session that ran perfectly on PT12 HD Native.

Current system = 7,1 2019 Mac Pro / 384G Ram, 2TB NVMe System, Session and Library drives. PT 2023.9 / HDX1 / HD i/o / UAD Octo Card.

Folks please just stop spamming this thread.

Mods can we please close this thread.

If you want to get effective help read the thread and think. This thread is about a fixed issue where a broken release of Pro Tools allowed the delay comp on a master fader to exceeded the system ADC limits. And that was changed in a subsequent release of Pro Tools. Your problem is clearly nothing to do with this so why are you posting here?

There is a boat load of latency and ADC issues in Pro Tools that many of us are aware of and can try to help you with. Look over the many other threads. Folks will help you...

And when you post elsewhere please try to explain stuff, like how can this be all native and not hybrid if you have HDX? Did you mean it's running all HDX/DSP and not hybrid? Or are you also running HD Native hardware? This is not making sense.

Personally I'd be using a "proper" hardware insert here and follow the steps for checking inset latency (but a HD I/O hardware insert should default to correct hardware latency). I've written many posts about how Pro Tools DigiLink and CoreAudio/ASIO hardware insert latency and ADC works/how to set stuff up (and some known bugs).

(And if you are running natively some how make sure ignore errors is not checked).

Simplify stuff down to a session with say two tracks and minimal plugins and do some testing.
Do a click or clap test and measure exactly what the latency is with and without ADC enabled... measure to a sample or so. That numeric value often gives clues what is going on. And what values are the ADC displays reporting.

If you can't find anything that exactly matches what you are seeing start your own new thread. If you are running HDX/DSP almost certainly the correct forum area is the HD/HDX one.

Please don't reply here, I expect this thread will be closed soon.