C|24 Advice

[Aaron Troughton]

Greetings!

My apologies first of all if this topic has already been covered at some point, there are quite a few threads to sift through to see if this was the case I’m afraid!

Now then, I’m considering a digital switch. The DDA AMR24 that I’m currently using is serving me well, However, it being an analogue desk that cant speak to my computer doesn’t help matters when I need to recall a set-up from a session since past for re-mixing purposes. I’ve been reading up on all the fantastic features and the C|24 seems like the one for me; there are a couple of things that I’m struggling with though.

I’m aware that the desk has 16 PRE's accessible through the D connectors on the rear, and with the cable kit that digidesign supply they then become a nice little set of 16 XLR's. I’m also aware the desk speaks to the computer via the Ethernet cable. So am i to understand that the audio information from your mic and line instruments enters the desk and then down the Ethernet cable to the computer, the same way it does for my MBOX2?

So in simpler terms, Does the C|24 act as the control surface AND the audio interface to the Computer, or do I also need to purchase a separate audio interface?

Cheers!

[dwhopson]

This is a good question. I was looking at the possibility of a pro-tools system based around the C|24.

If I'm not mistaken, you will have to have some type of LE or HD system with the C|24. What I haven't figured out is how you connect the control surface to an LE system (HD system is a little more logical). Surely, this can't be through a single CAT5 connector...for audio and control information.

Can someone shed some light on this?

Thanks!

[s.d. finley]

Ethernet is control information only.

Dsub is audio only.

So you hook your dsub i/o from your C/24 up to your monitors, patchbay (if you have'em) and your digi audio interfaces. LE and HD which are sold separately.

[Aaron Troughton]

Ahh! Great stuff. Much obliged my friend!

[BradLyons]

One thing to remember is that the C24 is a mixing surface only. Although there are micpres built-in, it is NOT a mixing console per say. Without either Pro Tools LE or Pro Tools HD, it's useless. With that said, the C24 is quite powerful indeed! I have (2) Pro Tools HD3 Accel systems, each with a Control24---one is used in my studio, the other at my church where I am not only multi-tracking via PTHD, but I'm also mixing live TV through it. I would like to upgrade to the C24, however not at this time. BUT what I will bring forth is common between the two units.

The C24 really is a means to control Pro Tools, as mentioned, however you can use the built-in pres and the built in monitor section. One mis-understanding is that the C24 is NOT an interface for Pro Tools. In other words, it still requires some sort of I/O to patch into. The other thing is, don't buy a C24 for the pres built-in because while they are useable, you can certainly buy better-sounding pres. There is a monitor section built-in, but IMHO something like a Presonus Central Station is still beneficial for a variety of reasons including a cleaner audio path---but is NOT required, the C24 still will certainly do the job, just as the built-in pres will for some. There is a great deal of flexibility in terms of "on the fly" mixing and control---something I find incredibly useful on my previous generation Control24's. When I'm editing and pre-mixing, I'm moving at lightning speed---I don't use the mouse to EQ or Compress, dial in reverb, etc. I use the buttons and knobs on the control surface. I can hit a button, pull up my list of plugins that are on that track and immediately bypass them all or select the one(s) I want to control in less than a second. I don't need to know where my mouse is, find the cursor, find the track, click on the right plugin window, etc. I can easily (and instantly) assign, edit, or adjust my aux's, eq's, pre/post bus sends, etc etc etc. In other words, all the C24 does is puts Pro Tools into your fingers and mix audio the way it was meant to do it----

The CAT5 cable is the data connection allowing the C24 and Pro Tools to communicate. The micpres built-in are on DB25 connectors, ideal to patch around to the front of your rack with something like the following:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/PT16FX2DB25/

Basically you take (2) DB25 to DB25 snakes to connect to the back of this unit, then plug your mics into the front. Of course, a standard patchbay can be used if you're wiring in direct with patching in the recording areas. If you want to feed returns from Pro Tools through the C24 for monitor control, then you'll need a snake (whatever temination you need) to DB25 to feed into the C24---then a DB25 snake out to whatever temination you need to feed your monitors, master recorder, headphone/cue system, etc. The C24 DOES offer everything that a project studio needs to communicate to the talent, control a great deal of Pro Tools, provide cues, mix, etc. On both of my Control24's, I have only the CAT5 and power cables connected----however there are those that use every function of the C24/Control24 including the built-in line submixer.

I hope that helps.

[Bill Denton]

Originally Posted by BradLyons

One thing to remember is that the C24 is a mixing surface only. Although there are micpres built-in, it is NOT a mixing console per say. Without either Pro Tools LE or Pro Tools HD, it's useless. With that said, the C24 is quite powerful indeed! I have (2) Pro Tools HD3 Accel systems, each with a Control24---one is used in my studio, the other at my church where I am not only multi-tracking via PTHD, but I'm also mixing live TV through it. I would like to upgrade to the C24, however not at this time. BUT what I will bring forth is common between the two units.

The C24 really is a means to control Pro Tools, as mentioned, however you can use the built-in pres and the built in monitor section. One mis-understanding is that the C24 is NOT an interface for Pro Tools. In other words, it still requires some sort of I/O to patch into. The other thing is, don't buy a C24 for the pres built-in because while they are useable, you can certainly buy better-sounding pres. There is a monitor section built-in, but IMHO something like a Presonus Central Station is still beneficial for a variety of reasons including a cleaner audio path---but is NOT required, the C24 still will certainly do the job, just as the built-in pres will for some. There is a great deal of flexibility in terms of "on the fly" mixing and control---something I find incredibly useful on my previous generation Control24's. When I'm editing and pre-mixing, I'm moving at lightning speed---I don't use the mouse to EQ or Compress, dial in reverb, etc. I use the buttons and knobs on the control surface. I can hit a button, pull up my list of plugins that are on that track and immediately bypass them all or select the one(s) I want to control in less than a second. I don't need to know where my mouse is, find the cursor, find the track, click on the right plugin window, etc. I can easily (and instantly) assign, edit, or adjust my aux's, eq's, pre/post bus sends, etc etc etc. In other words, all the C24 does is puts Pro Tools into your fingers and mix audio the way it was meant to do it----

The CAT5 cable is the data connection allowing the C24 and Pro Tools to communicate. The micpres built-in are on DB25 connectors, ideal to patch around to the front of your rack with something like the following:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/PT16FX2DB25/

Basically you take (2) DB25 to DB25 snakes to connect to the back of this unit, then plug your mics into the front. Of course, a standard patchbay can be used if you're wiring in direct with patching in the recording areas. If you want to feed returns from Pro Tools through the C24 for monitor control, then you'll need a snake (whatever temination you need) to DB25 to feed into the C24---then a DB25 snake out to whatever temination you need to feed your monitors, master recorder, headphone/cue system, etc. The C24 DOES offer everything that a project studio needs to communicate to the talent, control a great deal of Pro Tools, provide cues, mix, etc. On both of my Control24's, I have only the CAT5 and power cables connected----however there are those that use every function of the C24/Control24 including the built-in line submixer.

I hope that helps.

In addition to all of Brad's good info, it bears mentioning that, while pricey, Digidesign sells a snake "kit" that turns all of the DB25 connectors into standard XLR and TRS connectors...

[Aaron Troughton]

Well chaps, you've all been very helpfull indeed! Thankyou very much. Im sure that ill have a good look around to compare a few desks but the 24 is still in the lead me thinks!

Regards,
Aaron.

[digidesigner]

I'll jump in and ask here if it is possible to control DigiPre's with this control surface?

Why I ask is I have a crazy idea instead of getting a Venue system to kind of "enhance" my HD rig with C|24 and DigiPre's and turn it to a system that might be used for a live shows or as a studio setup. In my mind it would look something like this: a FOH rack with digipre's, 192's and a mac computer that has HD cards and can feed two LCD screens. A C|24 to control the system, an UPS unit.

[Bill Denton]

Originally Posted by digidesigner

I'll jump in and ask here if it is possible to control DigiPre's with this control surface?

Why I ask is I have a crazy idea instead of getting a Venue system to kind of "enhance" my HD rig with C|24 and DigiPre's and turn it to a system that might be used for a live shows or as a studio setup. In my mind it would look something like this: a FOH rack with digipre's, 192's and a mac computer that has HD cards and can feed two LCD screens. A C|24 to control the system, an UPS unit.

Page 82-83 of the C|24 guide details how to control the Digi Pre...