Upgrading the Digi002 console

[djkiller]

So i have the Digi002 all in one console not the rack and wanted to find some way to uprade it to make it sound better. I have already contacted BLR and they stopped doing those 2 years cause of cost and demand. The only thing they said they have from their company for what i have is a adc sparrow for like 628 or something like that with 2 channels.

now i've been reading up on things and I just paid 305 for my digi002 to be refurbished due to a blown firewire card, bad harness and a fader issue. so it's refurbished andi'll have it back next week. so what now? i'm a little new to all this and want to look into an upgrade but keep the digi002 becasue of finacial reason and money invested. is there any company other than BLA that does mods and will work on a Digi 002 console? what are the best option for having better sound? I've heard of clocking, ADC, better pres and some things only go optical and would cut down to 41khz. and then i hear use the other ones on the console without the pres. im very confused.

can someone break this down for me as how i can upgrade the overall performance and sound quality on my system? and what's the most important and maybe some hardware upgrade recommendations or a place that will mod this as BLA doesn't. or am i just stuck with this system and can't do anything better with it?

any feed back would be greatly appreciated.

[flommer]

Rosetta 800 + nice pres into ADAT

API A2D into SPDIF

that's 10 world class inputs and 2 pres for about $4500. 8 More mic pres will be at least another 2k for good quality..

Personally, I have my doubts about any of the octopre/digimax type preamp/converters as far as really making a leap in quality. It is likely they just sound different, not really much better than the 002 pres...

The good thing about buying good micpres is that they will work on any future system you get and they probably hold their value fairly well, especially if you purchase on ebay in the first place..

[Obsidian Dragon]

We are always looking for better sound. What is it about the 002 sound that you don't like? Is it not clear or it it not warm enough? What type of source are you capturing? Unfortunately there is not one solution for all sources. The stock mic pres and converters are not bad but not great either. I can only say they are pretty accurate. I would start with looking at what can be done to make ths source sound better first. (different room, better mic placement, acoustic treatment, even different talent, etc.) Secondly then I would look at the input chain (mic, mic pre, converters). Can the sound be improved with these. Can it be made to sound better with compression, EQ, etc.

We can always throw more expensive gear at the system but no amount to gear can make the source better.

[getz76]

Everything Obsidian Dragon and flommer said. The rest of your chain is likely much more important. At this level of gear, most material is not worth the 96kHz rate. 48kHz captures plenty of nuance...

[Reb]

Originally Posted by flommer

Rosetta 800 + nice pres into ADAT

API A2D into SPDIF

that's 10 world class inputs and 2 pres for about $4500. 8 More mic pres will be at least another 2k for good quality..

Personally, I have my doubts about any of the octopre/digimax type preamp/converters as far as really making a leap in quality. It is likely they just sound different, not really much better than the 002 pres...

The good thing about buying good micpres is that they will work on any future system you get and they probably hold their value fairly well, especially if you purchase on ebay in the first place..

Flommer, for that kind of cash, why not have him consider the HD upgrade that Digi is offering for LE owners? I think it would cost him approx. $5000 for the trade in and he would get HD1 with a free 96 i/o interface I believe.

[K Roche]

Originally Posted by djkiller

n i'm a little new to all this and want to look into an upgrade but keep the digi002 becasue of finacial reason and money invested. I've heard of clocking, ADC, better pres and some things only go optical and would cut down to 41khz. and then i hear use the other ones on the console without the pres. im very confused.

If selling your 002 and getting a good used 002r that could be modded by BLA is not an option. Then the 002 will still benefit from going around the pre's and converters with better ones.. First decide how many upgraded channels of pre's do you really need.. if its like me it was really only 2 as far as mic pre's, since that is the most mic's I would be recording at one time. So I went with a really good 2 channel mic pre and a Apogee Rosetta 200 which has better A/D -DA converters and clock than the 002. And if you go SPDIF from the Rosetta you can run up to 96k sample rate. into the 002. If you need all 8 then channels then there is the Rosetta 800 with better converters and clock, it has the 25 pin anolog in so you would have to have a snake and indeed it has only adat out so that would be at 44.1 but still a big improvement in the depth and presence of sound..
Hope this helps........ OH also the suggestion about the HD trade up with the free 96i/o is a vast improvement also but that would then require additional mic pre's as well, so that $5000. price then jumps to more like $7000 to $ 8000 minimum I would think . Kev

[wwittman]

Originally Posted by K Roche

If selling your 002 and getting a good used 002r that could be modded by BLA is not an option. Then the 002 will still benefit from going around the pre's and converters with better ones.. First decide how many upgraded channels of pre's do you really need.. if its like me it was really only 2 as far as mic pre's, since that is the most mic's I would be recording at one time. So I went with a really good 2 channel mic pre and a Apogee Rosetta 200 which has better A/D -DA converters and clock than the 002. And if you go SPDIF from the Rosetta you can run up to 96k sample rate. into the 002. If you need all 8 then channels then there is the Rosetta 800 with better converters and clock, it has the 25 pin anolog in so you would have to have a snake and indeed it has only adat out so that would be at 44.1 but still a big improvement in the depth and presence of sound..
Hope this helps........ OH also the suggestion about the HD trade up with the free 96i/o is a vast improvement also but that would then require additional mic pre's as well, so that $5000. price then jumps to more like $7000 to $ 8000 minimum I would think . Kev

except that I would AVOID being limited to lower sampling rates, I otherwise agree completely with this.

that's good advice all round.

[getz76]

There's some misinformation here. ADAT on the 002/003 is 24-bit/48kHz.

[flommer]

Originally Posted by Reb

Flommer, for that kind of cash, why not have him consider the HD upgrade that Digi is offering for LE owners? I think it would cost him approx. $5000 for the trade in and he would get HD1 with a free 96 i/o interface I believe.

It is a possibility, but there is still more money to spend... I don't know what kind of 'puter dj has, but if not a MacPro (or... gasp... peecee) then that's part of the upgrade, too.. Plus if you get HD you are stuck with ProTools for the duration. That means TDM plugins, ie more money. Not that that is a terrible thing, but all the gear I mentioned will work in any (most) future scenarios.. The Rosetta will even act as an additional AD for HD with the right card.. the Mic pres would always be desirable.. More flexibility...

Also, I don't recall too many people singing their praises of the 96io as really outstanding.. The 192 is bigger bucks still..

One Item I didn't mention is the Ensemble.. I thought it was only a FW interface but I think they upgraded it to act as a stand alone converter... And it has Mic pres tooo, for about 2k..

Basically, to really get some serious quality upgrade from 002-003 you're gonna need to spend some pretty serious $, and you better understand your needs very well before dropping that kind of cash.. It's almost a "if you gotta ask..." kind of situation...

[djkiller]

well i have a mac quad core pro with 7gb of ram and a pair of mr8's i just have it hooked up to my 42 inch lcd for more screen space and i use a usb midiman i bought along time ago plus other random gear like gibson les paul studio, a warlock bass, roland jx3p, qy70, roland xp 10 and some modded synths from pawn shops i modded myself for a cool 8 bit sound to mix with higher end sounds. i like to experiment a lot and do indie, rock, industiral and retro kinda music..kinda like a fusion of all. acutally i hardly ever use pro tools 8 any more..mainly use logic 9, i find i get a better sound out of my midi and every thing and at bounce a better warmer final mix. it makes a big difference no idea why maybe different software, almost all 1stparty plugins and different algorithms. only thing i usually record from a mic is vocals, organ, chimes and foley stuff like i said i like to be experimental literlly will use pots and pans lol. my guitar goes direct in so maybe a di box on the guitar would help also for decreased noise and a smoother signal. mic wise i just have a basic 100 dollar sure mic but a lot of singer have there own mics most of the time they bring in. don't have an amp anymore sold my marshall tube halfstack for 1,800 for rent 4 years ago and since then have always used other peoples amps for live gigs. my old singer i use to play with had money and would buy stuff for me and bought me a marshall half stack but it's under the conditions i use it with him on project...kinda a creative black mail since i compose/write everything, run live sequences and he use to sing, he thought i was worth it i guess.

but i appreciate all the info and any more would be appreciated. actually i talked to black lion audio a few times via email about my situation and they recommended the same thing by selling the digi002 and buying a digi002r and what's left over in money match it with the mod would be my best bet over all. keep any new ideas coming guys and no way with the hd like i said i'm using logic 9 until protools makes some software i actually like again.