Protools LE and the fight of its life?

[mdanielson007]

Just remember, just because it's cheap doesn't always mean it's the best way to go. You sacrifice having halfway decent pre's interface and plugin processing power, just because a DAW can sort of do what the big boys do, doesn't make it any better..

..Think of how many corners were cut to bring their product price level so low.

..find out how many employees the company has, if it's just two coders and boss, whose gonna answer the phone at midnight when you need tech support. I applaud some of the little guys jumping in the big fish's tank, but until the average lay person understands everything in the digital domain, I think all the home-based productions on home studios are sincerely going to degrade the trade that so many of us still learn on a daily basis, and very few actually 'master'..

[kelldammit]

Originally Posted by mdanielson007

I hear MOTU's Digital Performer is great for audio post, but I'm pretty sold on the simplicity and integrity of digi..

dp is great for working with picture, particularly scoring. i really like the editing, too.
it was also (for a time) the best integrated 3rd party front end for pt hardware. if you're comfortable with pt, it's not really very much different. in fact, many of the new pt8 midi editor features were basically lifted from dp. allowing mixer/arrangement tracks to be hideable/viewable on the fly was most likely inspired there also...
many other conventions are pretty much the same between the two. i'm sure that motu and digi have been stealing features back and forth for years. at least they seem to be stealing the best ones!

kell

[guitardom]

Just remember, just because it's cheap doesn't always mean it's the best way to go. You sacrifice having halfway decent pre's interface and plugin processing power, just because a DAW can sort of do what the big boys do, doesn't make it any better..

..Think of how many corners were cut to bring their product price level so low.

this point is easy to disagree with. you are making it sound as if digi is superior in these areas and it is not at all. they have the worst cpu utilization and worst plugin performance of most any audio app out there. just because its bigger does not make it better. many of us have just been using pro tools so long we know it best and easiest for us to stay than to teach us new tricks. not sticking around for these reasons! and to say price has something to do with it is not true either. what about products like massey?

..find out how many employees the company has, if it's just two coders and boss, whose gonna answer the phone at midnight when you need tech support. I applaud some of the little guys jumping in the big fish's tank, but until the average lay person understands everything in the digital domain, I think all the home-based productions on home studios are sincerely going to degrade the trade that so many of us still learn on a daily basis, and very few actually 'master'..

avid/digidesign dont answer the phone at midnight either. 8:30am-5pm pacific time.

honestly how much more "damage" can home studios do???? a converter, couple mic pre's, and software is how much?? a couple hundred bucks?? i dont see it getting any cheaper. the big studios had to the serious adapting like changing business models, offering new services, maybe drop prices a bit, offer less freebies like food/drinks, 5-8 years ago and has been on a steady plane since till the drop in the economy took out some that are hangin on the edge. imo opinion these new apps like studio one and record are a step up from the pirated cubase and cakewalk that took the world by storm in the late 90's or so. a nice room and quality outboard can never be substituted. that is the dividing factor between home and professional studio.

[mykhal c]

Originally Posted by guitardom

this point is easy to disagree with. you are making it sound as if digi is superior in these areas and it is not at all. they have the worst cpu utilization and worst plugin performance of most any audio app out there. just because its bigger does not make it better. many of us have just been using pro tools so long we know it best and easiest for us to stay than to teach us new tricks. not sticking around for these reasons! and to say price has something to do with it is not true either. what about products like massey?



avid/digidesign dont answer the phone at midnight either. 8:30am-5pm pacific time.

honestly how much more "damage" can home studios do???? a converter, couple mic pre's, and software is how much?? a couple hundred bucks?? i dont see it getting any cheaper. the big studios had to the serious adapting like changing business models, offering new services, maybe drop prices a bit, offer less freebies like food/drinks, 5-8 years ago and has been on a steady plane since till the drop in the economy took out some that are hangin on the edge. imo opinion these new apps like studio one and record are a step up from the pirated cubase and cakewalk that took the world by storm in the late 90's or so. a nice room and quality outboard can never be substituted. that is the dividing factor between home and professional studio.

+1...what you said. tho it was an 'easy' rebuttal, you still get full grade credit!!!

[mykhal c]

Originally Posted by guitardom

the selling point to me on record is its "mastering" capabilities. go into mastering mode and can access ALL of my songs i want in this mode, add eq compression, anything globally from here and then burn my disc straight out here!!!! my biggest thought is that i wonder if i can do crossfades between songs with track markers and such, which is why i have to use cd architect from time to time.

the amount of time i can save here is just plain amazing!

steve, pretty sure you were talkin' S1 and not RECORD in that post

[peppertree]

Yes...well compare Digi's release cycle to Logic's. Digi is roughly right in their release frequency, there's a fascinating delay right now though...

And as I've said before, one fully activated and interested Justin (of Reaper) is worth about 100 well-managed ordinary coders. Read "the tyranny of the normal distribution" in "the Triumph of the Nerds" to understand why. Plus he is the boss and doesn't wait for permission or cues from anyone else.

And putting those two points together, I remember clearly going to a music tech demo two years ago with a couple digi execs (that you would recognize) and being shocked that they weren't even aware of Reaper at that point! And the rats nibbled away at the dinosaur's empire...

Originally Posted by Socrates

Better they speak with actions. Like fixing a few of the bugs in the existing version.

Reaper has about one guy doing the core product, and he releases builds almost daily. As I said earlier, sort of a permanent state of beta.

I understand a studio needs a stable product to operate as a business and can't take the risk or time to install 4 upgrades a week. OTOH, they may be overly cautious and taking too long to release upgrades. I am a programmer, and I have known large organizations where the upgrade process takes longer than the programming. Didn't see much of an increase in quality either--just a cumbersome process.

I bought reaper for personal use--$35 or so, big deal. I want to make pro tools work as my main daw, but its conceivable that reaper will gain such momentum that avid, cakewalk, and others for that matter, will have a big problem on their hands. A competitor that costs several hundred dollars less than their flagship products.

This happens all the time--its called commoditization of a product. It requires a different strategy than owning the market by being the first and best as pro tools did initially. Its also less profitable, but competitive forces are inexorable and can only be denied at one's peril.

[guitardom]

Originally Posted by mykhal c

steve, pretty sure you were talkin' S1 and not RECORD in that post

oh!! nice catch, yes we were all talking about studio one and somehow i got a name switch going........OOOOPPSS

[mykhal c]

Originally Posted by guitardom

oh!! nice catch, yes we were all talking about studio one and somehow i got a name switch going........OOOOPPSS

yeah the discussion started off RECORD then S1 then RECORD then....S1....'cause here i go again....if they include WARP markers for EA type manipulation...OMG i'm droolin' again...where's my bib?? i had to wash the one from yesterday me and Shane have been goin' back and forth on the EA/WARP marker thingy. i can't wait for a little more seepage on their beta we need a mole!!!

[TOM@METRO]

Originally Posted by guitardom

a nice room and quality outboard can never be substituted. that is the dividing factor between home and professional studio.

What he said.

[guy.fi]

Originally Posted by Shan

When I first installed PT LE 5.01 with my 001 and PIII computer 10 years ago, I just wanted to double click the PT Icon and start recording music after it was installed. Back then I knew next to nothing about computers and the inner workings of Operatiing Systems and I also had no interest at all in that technical aspect side of things. I just wanted to record music. Fast forward 10 years, and thanks to Digidesign, I'm now a computer technician guru and Operating System wizard that I had no intention on ever becoming. I just wanted to record music.

Shane

Man, this is exactly how I feel (though you got about a year on me and it was AMD for me).

Guy