Re-learning to mix ITB?

[O.G. Killa]

Originally Posted by peppertree

(indeed one of the world's leading universities hired me to build their entire audio program from scratch when I was only 20) and am speaking from my experience.

Really, just like you used to work at some of the "world class" studios here in LA...yet when talking about studio rates you were off by a factor of TEN!!! I would think someone who worked at world class studios in LA would know how much they charge per day...

And WHICH university? Which audio program? Everything you say is meaningless and fictitious unless you actually name names.

For example I could say I worked for a a world-renound software company as a sound engineer, and we were the leader in our industry taking 80% of the market share. And with that company I helped develop certain audio systems for a very well-known luxury car manufacturer.

All of that is complete BS unless I use names and give context to VALIDATE my claim.

So instead I would say, I worked at Dragon Systems as a sound engineer, and we were the leader in the speech recognition industry taking 80% of the market share. And while working at Dragon Systems I helped Ford speech enable their Jaguar product lines with a partnership Dragon made with Ford's subsidiary, Visteon.

See the difference?

[peppertree]

My wish for all is that they gain enough self-confidence to forget about cocksize contests and open their minds to any and all input. Even if from a 4 year old. (They can be rather perceptive, and quite forthright.)

I don't participate in such contests, and it's not because I'd lose them. It's because the sophmoric desire to establish a pecking order just makes everyone lose.

[Drew Mazurek]

Don't waste your time Derek. You're obviously talented and have better things to do with your time.

This guy's a toolbag and a troll.

[O.G. Killa]

Originally Posted by dmazurek

Don't waste your time Derek. You're obviously talented and have better things to do with your time.

This guy's a toolbag and a troll.

Thanks... In the end, peppertree's opinion has no value with me because he just isn't that important. But, at the same time I'm going to call a spade a spade. I'm just surprised Digi has let his rhetoric go on for so long and haven't banned him yet. He really doesn't bring anything to the party except a lot of hot air. In trying to be politically correct and give everyone their voice, Digi has allowed a few people to ruin the duc for everyone else. I guess that's one of the nice things about forums like "whatever works" on PSW. You have to state who you are, they hold you accountable for everything you say, and delete your posts if you try to be anonymous, or can't back up your claims with real examples.

[JFreak]

Originally Posted by O.G. Killa

For example I could say I worked for a a world-renound software company as a sound engineer, and we were the leader in our industry taking 80% of the market share. And with that company I helped develop certain audio systems for a very well-known luxury car manufacturer.

Nice wording :)

Reminds me of my days at "global mobile phone manufacturer as a build manager, pioneering internet-enabled smartphones 10 years ago", but it doesn't mean I was developing iPhones for Apple

[O.G. Killa]

Originally Posted by JFreak

Nice wording :)

Reminds me of my days at "global mobile phone manufacturer as a build manager, pioneering internet-enabled smartphones 10 years ago", but it doesn't mean I was developing iPhones for Apple

EXACTLY MY POINT!!!

This world leading university he speaks of could very well be "world leading" in business management, or architecture, or basket weaving... Or they could be "world leading" not in the academic excellence of their program but in their ability to coax students to enroll (University of Phoenix online or Full Sail anyone?). If they are hiring a 20 yr old kid to design their audio program... my guess is they aren't known for anything to do with audio in the first place, nor will they.

[WernerF]

Originally Posted by O.G. Killa

OK...this is like the 3rd time you brought this up. I've been trying to bite my tongue every time you mention this...but I can't anymore.

I checked out your myspace page and listened to some of the bands you've produced. The first one I went to itunes to check out, called "Priestess - Hello Master" had this review of your work...

For that to be the review of the album ON ITUNES, that is rough. For them to talk about the album cover as what impressed them about the album and then go on to pretty much shoot down your production, doesn't bode well for you as a producer... I mean this review is supposed to be helping to SELL the product and that is the best they could say?!!!?

And here's another quote from iTunes for the "The Stills" (the Oceans Will Rise album) a band which it seems you've produced all of their albums...

I really hate to say this, but you mentioned "Should they recall those products because they weren't done properly", and my answer is, they don't need to. None of them ever sold and were probably returned to the label anyway. Did they NOT sell because they weren't done properly?? Who knows...

In listening to the "products" you've put out. From a musical standpoint they are fun. More power to you. From a mixing, engineering and sonic standpoint I didn't really care for them. In other words, I personally didn't like the sound of them that much. The snare on a lot of them sounded papery and the drums have this weird midrange boxiness to them. The guitars were always drowning out everything except for the vocals. The vocals usually sound great, but they stick out from the rest of the song and feel like they are slapped "on top of" the mix instead of being part of the mix itself. Everyone's a critic, I know. And I know my opinion doesn't really matter that much.

So, in looking at what you do, I have much respect for you as a musician and a producer (even though the reviews seem to taunt your production abilities). But at the same time my personal tastes are different than yours (which probably explains our differing views on things). So let's just agree to disagree.

I apologize if I'm coming across as a jerk or a dick here. That's not my intention. It's just that you keep harping on the fact that you "make albums for labels so that automatically means [your] !@#$ don't stink". It just seems really condescending and egotistical of you to look down on all of us, when you aren't burning up the charts or sales reports with your efforts either. Granted, those things don't necessarily mean anything. But when you keep referencing all the "work you've done for labels" (and mentioning RCA and Atlantic, when in actuality they never hired you, the albums were later distributed through them), then you are subtly trying to put some sort of value on things like chart ratings and soundscan reports as a gauge for how good your products are.

You have to realize a lot of us on these forums work in the music industry for a living as well. And some of the people posting here are pretty well-known for what they do (not including myself in that list by any means). So....you might want to stop waiting for your turn to talk and actually just listen to what's being said here for a minute.

Regards.

Hey Derek, I wasn't gonna come back to this thread and derail it any further but I can't let this particular misinformation go unanswered. I owe it to the bands at least.

Yah, Priestess didn't sell that much. The Stills, however, sold more than three hundred thousand copies on their first record and the one that came out about a year ago just won us and them a Juno for Best Alternative Album of the Year. The first album was on Atlantic and they did in fact hire us directly. It was just a Vice/Atlantic product as an imprint. As for reviews, iTunes doesn't mean s--t. The ones that actually mattered were totally different. Also, the sounds of those records were done very intentionally. I don't know if you listen to any Indie Rock bands but that is what they are going for. Some of them, Spoon and Kings of Leon for instance have crossed over with much the same sound. Kings of Leon and the Stills are best buds and tour together all of the time. The notion of sounding slick and K Rock polished makes them want to puke and they would not want anything to do with us if we took that approach. Not that it matters, but your choice of drum sounds, the ones that I heard on your library material, would never work for these type of bands. They want what we have done for them and I actually like the way it sounds too. I could never do this kind of work if I didn't. And, incidentally, it was all done ITB. There are, by the way, many more bands that we have done that are not on that silly MySpace page that sound quite different. I respect your opinion, I just think you should do a more thorough job in the artist research department. I would never in a million years mention any of this artist related stuff if it hadn't been directly attacked here.

Now we can agree to disagree.

[midnightrambler]

Back to the topic for just a sec, can I ask what sample rate people are generally working at? Is 88kHz or 96kHz the new standard for most people?

Confession 1: I'm still working at 44.1kHz (blush!).

Confession 2: When I get tracks in for mixing that aren't 44.1kHz, I make a point of converting them, just to make sure I can run all plugs etc without any hassles...(double blush!). I have to admit to feeling guilty about it, but no one (as yet!) has actually ever noticed.

[mano111]

Vast majority of post production session I do @ 48khz 24bit. Some 48/16.
Music sessions are typically 44.1/24.
I'm not blushing. Should I?
:)

[WernerF]

I only ever use 44.1. That topic is, however, a whole other thread that has been pretty much beaten to death also.