Future PTHD 11 and TDM users .. Please AVID!!

[solidmastering]

"""Therefore I ask that Avid reconsider it’s decision to remove support for TDM in Pro Tools 11 and beyond until there are significantly more HDX plug-ins available.

It is my understanding that Avid’s decision to abandon support for TDM is NOT because it is technically impossible to implement but a marketing decision.

I question Avid’s claim for the following reasons.

TDM is already working in a 64 bit environment. The TDM card is on the PCI bus and in communication with the host. Mac OSX is now fully 64 bit and yet TDM cards still work.

Apple’s Logic Audio is a 64 bit application running in fully 64 bit operating system on a Mac Pro starting up in 64 bit kernal mode. It works perfectly well with TDM via the Avid Core Audio driver. If a 3rd party 64 bit application like Logic can operate with TDM then why can’t Pro Tools?

All the other audio hardware manufacturers have made the transition to 64 bit including UAD and its DSP PCI cards. Is it really that much more difficult for Avid to do the same with TDM?

Please Avid... for the benefit of your loyal customers, keep TDM going a little while longer so we can continue to use the tools we know and rely on and also benefit from your latest technologies.""""

Please AVID , dont forget us , dont forget TDM (Accel) users .
We have paid high($$$$) for ours Rigs (HD Accel).

[solidmastering]

TDM users will therefore be forced to purchase Avid’s new HDX technology if they wish to upgrade to Pro Tools 11.

This presents a significant problem for many TDM users. At present there is a chronic shortage of 3rd party plug-ins compatible with the HDX format.

* Waves, undoubtedly the leading 3rd party plug-in developer currently has no plans to produce an HDX version of its plug-ins.

* Soundtoys has not yet made a decision wether it will develop HDX versions of its plug-ins

* URS and Abbey Road.... No mention of HDX versions anywhere.

* Eventide has yet to release an HDX version of its flagship Anthology bundle.

* Audioease has said there will be an HDX version of Altiverb but are unsure when it will be released.

* It appears Avid itself has yet to convert all it’s OWN plug-ins to HDX format! This almost a year after HDX's release!

* Sonnox has only released two HDX compatible plug-ins so far.

* TC Electronics has said it will NEVER be supporting HDX.

* There will be no HDX versions of Amp Farm, Echo Farm and Virus Indigo.

* Native Instruments has released a few AAX virtual instruments but otherwise the AAX VI situation is dire.

* VSL has said there will be an AAX version of VE Pro but who knows when!!!

This appalling lack of 3rd party plug-in support means many TDM users will not purchase HDX systems until there are a LOT more 3rd party plug-ins available. Many plug-in developers will not support HDX until a LOT more HDX systems have been sold. This is a vicious circle that hurts both Avid and its end users.

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by solidmastering

TDM users will therefore be forced to purchase Avid’s new HDX technology if they wish to upgrade to Pro Tools 11.

This presents a significant problem for many TDM users. At present there is a chronic shortage of 3rd party plug-ins compatible with the HDX format.

* Waves, undoubtedly the leading 3rd party plug-in developer currently has no plans to produce an HDX version of its plug-ins.

* Soundtoys has not yet made a decision wether it will develop HDX versions of its plug-ins

* URS and Abbey Road.... No mention of HDX versions anywhere.

* Eventide has yet to release an HDX version of its flagship Anthology bundle.

* Audioease has said there will be an HDX version of Altiverb but are unsure when it will be released.

* It appears Avid itself has yet to convert all it’s OWN plug-ins to HDX format! This almost a year after HDX's release!

* Sonnox has only released two HDX compatible plug-ins so far.

* TC Electronics has said it will NEVER be supporting HDX.

* There will be no HDX versions of Amp Farm, Echo Farm and Virus Indigo.

* Native Instruments has released a few AAX virtual instruments but otherwise the AAX VI situation is dire.

* VSL has said there will be an AAX version of VE Pro but who knows when!!!

This appalling lack of 3rd party plug-in support means many TDM users will not purchase HDX systems until there are a LOT more 3rd party plug-ins available. Many plug-in developers will not support HDX until a LOT more HDX systems have been sold. This is a vicious circle that hurts both Avid and its end users.

Here we go, another thread reiterating the same things that just got whacked about the head over here http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=329408. Is there a reason you had to restart this as a new thread and could just not comment over there?

Please stop whining and if this still bothers you when Pro Tools 11 is available then stay on Pro Tools 10 with TDM. Pro Tools 11 is something that will happen in the future, not now, by then things will be even further along. The backlash in this whole thread is against people who are just whinging about stuff they want and yet also not willing to recognize there is stuff you need to let go of to get other things, like 64 bit support.

So what do you want? Stay on 32 bit with TDM support or go 64 bits. Avid is leaving the door open for _you_ to choose.

Pro Tools 10 is a transition release with AAX 32 bit support to shake out AAX ready for a full 64 bit jump, but leaves TDM and RTAS support in there for compatibility/to ease a transition. Pro Tools 10 is going to have to be around for a long time. And its reassuring how Avid is jumping all over problems people are finding with Pro Tools 10.

Do you think Avid does not get any of these plugin issues? Does not have a frigging clue about the market, technology and plugins that customers use? They need to learn this from reading DUC? If you really think that you should give up now and switch DAWs because if the vendor is that frigging stupid...there is no hope.

On the contrary, I look at the standing start on AAX that plugin vendors had not that long ago. And to me it seems there is actually an impressive number of AAX plugin available already, yes Waves is a black-eye and I suspect whatever going on there will damage both Waves and Avid if they can't sort this out before Pro Tools 11 release. But again even worse case its your choice, stay on Pro Tools 10 with Waves or work out other options and move forward.

I've been though multiple 64 bit technology transitions from both customer and technology vendor (Silicon Graphics, VMware and slightly with Adobe) sides, these are never easy and I'm actually impressed how Avid is doing here, how they are able to get vendors to release 32 bit AAX ports (whether native and/or HDX) knowing 64 bit AAX is going to require them to do yet more work to release the same AAX plugins again for Pro Tools 11. I suspect vendors who have said they will do AAX in future but are not being clear when or have not release anything yet are likely trying to avoid releasing 32 bit AAX at all, certainly makes most sense for the VI vendors who will benefit significanly from 64 bit AAX native.

And there is hope even in the pessimistic list above. Eventide for example has AAX native plugins out already (e.g. Blackhole), so a good sign they are testing the waters, have developers working on understanding AAX, yes only AAX native so far but its progress.

Darryl

[phatbeatstudio]

No need to worry in time everybody will use the metric system and then we wont have to worry about it.

If you like TDM cool , I did to until I bought and used HDX , you know all those things that piss you off about TDM , the $7000 each card upgrade for almost no extra processing ,32 bit only , chip eating TDM RTAS TDM RTAS voice thief's not to mention a variety of other things as well ,

Get your self a nice PENTIUM 1, 450 mhz , 2 gigs of ram one of those hi tech monitors that always flickers and live the glory days of TDM .
at least I suped up the ram for ya !
or type go to command ,HDX
but you probably dont know what that means.


Just stay on this version it wont stop working !

[JFreak]

Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm

So what do you want? Stay on 32 bit with TDM support or go 64 bits. Avid is leaving the door open for _you_ to choose.

Actually, come to think of it -- no, they're not. That's just what they're doing, closing a door that could be open.

Yes, TDM could survive in the 64-bit PT software. Yes, it could technically be done (if what I've heard is true). It's just that for a fact AAX cannot live happily with TDM/RTAS and the full power of the new plugins can only be unleashed when the old plugs are no longer in the system. That is the #1 point -- or problem -- that Avid has.

CAN they do two different 64-bit PT11 releases? Sure they can. They just don't want to. Keeping the code manageable sometimes requires that unnecessary "branches" need to be cut out, and unfortunately, TDM has now become such a burden.

Who's to blame? Every one of us who have been demanding better performing plugin system to replace RTAS. That's exactly what Avid is doing with AAX.

[solidmastering]

Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm

Here we go, another thread reiterating the same things that just got whacked about the head over here http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=329408. Is there a reason you had to restart this as a new thread and could just not comment over there?

Please stop whining and if this still bothers you when Pro Tools 11 is available then stay on Pro Tools 10 with TDM. Pro Tools 11 is something that will happen in the future, not now, by then things will be even further along. The backlash in this whole thread is against people who are just whinging about stuff they want and yet also not willing to recognize there is stuff you need to let go of to get other things, like 64 bit support.

So what do you want? Stay on 32 bit with TDM support or go 64 bits. Avid is leaving the door open for _you_ to choose.

Pro Tools 10 is a transition release with AAX 32 bit support to shake out AAX ready for a full 64 bit jump, but leaves TDM and RTAS support in there for compatibility/to ease a transition. Pro Tools 10 is going to have to be around for a long time. And its reassuring how Avid is jumping all over problems people are finding with Pro Tools 10.

Do you think Avid does not get any of these plugin issues? Does not have a frigging clue about the market, technology and plugins that customers use? They need to learn this from reading DUC? If you really think that you should give up now and switch DAWs because if the vendor is that frigging stupid...there is no hope.

On the contrary, I look at the standing start on AAX that plugin vendors had not that long ago. And to me it seems there is actually an impressive number of AAX plugin available already, yes Waves is a black-eye and I suspect whatever going on there will damage both Waves and Avid if they can't sort this out before Pro Tools 11 release. But again even worse case its your choice, stay on Pro Tools 10 with Waves or work out other options and move forward.

I've been though multiple 64 bit technology transitions from both customer and technology vendor (Silicon Graphics, VMware and slightly with Adobe) sides, these are never easy and I'm actually impressed how Avid is doing here, how they are able to get vendors to release 32 bit AAX ports (whether native and/or HDX) knowing 64 bit AAX is going to require them to do yet more work to release the same AAX plugins again for Pro Tools 11. I suspect vendors who have said they will do AAX in future but are not being clear when or have not release anything yet are likely trying to avoid releasing 32 bit AAX at all, certainly makes most sense for the VI vendors who will benefit significanly from 64 bit AAX native.

And there is hope even in the pessimistic list above. Eventide for example has AAX native plugins out already (e.g. Blackhole), so a good sign they are testing the waters, have developers working on understanding AAX, yes only AAX native so far but its progress.

Darryl

Dude dont be rude ...

I dont care about plugins .. AAX blah blah blah .. i prefer use analog gear for it.
the main question is , why we (TDM users) have to pay for a new Card just only for running a new PT ?
Its not fair , leave us alone , Avid is a wiinner $$$$

What like in PT10 ? .. editing .. summing ..

So whats fair ?
Give us a choice .. two versions .. one for TDM user (32bits) and another for new HDX users ..

HDX for me ? why more processing ?
i dont need it .. and of course many studios with real gears dont need much processing (plugins) ..

Avid in the future will do it again .. HDX will be old .. and a NEW HDXX will be up to date .. and all of us will have to upgrade .. sorry .. pay more and more money for AVID again , and again.

Sorry man, but in real life we have option .. and if it is not good for me ?
time to make changes .. Sequoia or another ..

thx

[JNS]

Originally Posted by phatbeatstudio

Get your self a nice PENTIUM 1, 450 mhz , 2 gigs of ram one of those hi tech monitors that always flickers and live the glory days of TDM .
at least I suped up the ram for ya !
or type go to command ,HDX
but you probably dont know what that means.

You really get off on belittling people, don't you? Second time I've seen you do it in a couple of weeks and there are probably more.

[Dism]

Originally Posted by JFreak

CAN they do two different 64-bit PT11 releases? Sure they can. They just don't want to. Keeping the code manageable sometimes requires that unnecessary "branches" need to be cut out, and unfortunately, TDM has now become such a burden.

It isn't about "not wanting to." Avid is a company low on time, money and resources. Dwindling staff, outsourcing, and demand for progress is more important than what they want to do. It has nothing to do with what they can do, and simply what they can afford to do. They can't afford another year of low sales, and bloated software. Back tracking would only slow them down more, and would not promote the sales of HDX cards. If they kept TDM in the code for PT11, what would encourage anyone to buy HDX? They can't survive on software upgrades alone. Avid is a hardware company.

[JFreak]

Originally Posted by Dism

It has nothing to do with what they can do, and simply what they can afford to do.

Exactly what I was saying

[studiojimi]

lower the inflated salaries.... elevate more loyal customer love.