PT HD inquiry

[ballsd33p]

heyo

Ok. So. Tons of questions that have already been answered before - go - I've had it. Im sick and tired of mixing and my computer not being able to handle it. Not only am I going to buy a new computer, BUT, I'm really thinking about HD. The problem is - am I going to need to buy the damn 192 i/o with it too? Call me stoopid and point out that If Im interested in HD I should understand the common idiosyncrasies that have to do with the system - but I just don't need that much I/O right now. I'm content with the capabilities of an mbox mini. Really. I just really, really need the power to mix more fluently and productively, and be able to record a vocal or guitar track here and then. Shouldn't I just buy the old HD process cards which are totally in a reasonable price range? Would I be able to use my mbox as an interface? The problem with pro tools hd cards is that it is very expensive old technology for a single user, but very reasonably priced for an organization. All I want is the power from the card. How practical is this?

[Shan]

Originally Posted by ballsd33p

...I just really, really need the power to mix more fluently and productively, and be able to record a vocal or guitar track here and then.

HD would probably be a bit overkill for those basic recording needs in my honest opinion especially if an Mbox mini fits your I/O needs.

If you're having problems getting an Mbox going, then the thing to look at is your current computer configuration. You're still going to have to set up and configure your system whether for LE or HD and it's no small task. I'm curious to see your current computer spec. Providing if you're even on PC, if you post a Sandra report I(and others) can have a detailed look to see what's up.

Pro Tools is not plug and play. Other info to read if you're on PC.

Shane

[BradLyons]

I agree----if you're looking into the idea of PTHD yet the MBox Mini fits your needs, PTHD is significant overkill both in the quality of I/O and the cost to outfit the system. While there are numerous reasons that PTHD is well worth the expense, again what you're saying is conflicting. I would say, possibly, just buy yourself a new, top of the line computer, possibly upgrade your PTLE interface, maybe add a better converter---and be done.

[chrisdee]

Originally Posted by ballsd33p

heyo

Ok. So. Tons of questions that have already been answered before - go - I've had it. Im sick and tired of mixing and my computer not being able to handle it. Not only am I going to buy a new computer, BUT, I'm really thinking about HD. The problem is - am I going to need to buy the damn 192 i/o with it too? Call me stoopid and point out that If Im interested in HD I should understand the common idiosyncrasies that have to do with the system - but I just don't need that much I/O right now. I'm content with the capabilities of an mbox mini. Really. I just really, really need the power to mix more fluently and productively, and be able to record a vocal or guitar track here and then. Shouldn't I just buy the old HD process cards which are totally in a reasonable price range? Would I be able to use my mbox as an interface? The problem with pro tools hd cards is that it is very expensive old technology for a single user, but very reasonably priced for an organization. All I want is the power from the card. How practical is this?

Consider getting a supported computer. As for interface I would wait untill the 12 of April to se if some new interface is coming from Avid that will replace Mbox2pro / 003.

[ballsd33p]

yes.. no doubt a new computer would definitely aid in this situation. My computer now has an extremely outdated processor, but I'm running Xp SP3, 4gb ram, 2 TB sata HD's @ 7200rpm. The point I was trying to get at though is that I'm mainly just going to be mixing and mastering - not recording groups (yet) - and personally I like the idea of having enough power to have all of my tracks up and running with inserts and plugins without processing 2/3 of the tracks before I've decided that something doesn't fit. Not to say that I don't do that now.. It's just that the guessing game gets very tedious.. I run alot of tracks with alot of plugins and I just need more power! So much so that it goes beyond routinely processing a track here or there to gain some headroom.


brad, what do you mean by a better converter?

chrisdee, yea it seems like digidesign has alot of stuff in the works.

thanks for your replies guys-

[nst7]

Brad was referring a better converter-meaning a better analog to digital converter. But you need a digital input to use that, and it looks like you have the mbox mini, which does not have a spidf (digital) input. You would need to at least upgrade to a regular mbox 2 or higher to have that. Then you would buy a 3rd party converter (many different ones out there). And if you did that, you would need to buy a separate mic preamp to use with it. Keep in mind that with an HD system you would still need to buy a preamp anyway. But adding these things to your existing rig would upgrade the sound quality of what you're recording and is still way cheaper than an HD system.

These things would not help your processing power, a new computer will do that. But they will help the sound quality of what you're recording. But again, you would need to upgrade to at least the mbox2 to do this.

[O.G. Killa]

Originally Posted by ballsd33p

yes.. no doubt a new computer would definitely aid in this situation! My computer now has an extremely outdated processor, but I'm running Xp SP3, 4gb ram, 2 TB sata HD's @ 7200rpm. The point I was trying to get at though is that I'm mainly just going to be mixing and mastering - not recording groups (yet) - and personally I like the idea of having enough power to have all of my tracks up and running with inserts and plugins without processing 2/3 of the tracks before I've decided that something doesn't fit. Not to say that I don't do that now.. It's just that the guessing game gets very tedious.. I run alot of tracks with alot of plugins and I just need more power! So much so that it goes beyond routinely processing a track here or there to gain some headroom.


brad, what do you mean by a better converter?

chrisdee, yea it seems like digidesign has alot of stuff in the works.

thanks for all your replies guys-

Your ability to mix in PTLE is solely based on your CPU processing power and your RAM. Getting a new computer with a Two QuadCore i7 processors might be the way for you to go, as it will probably add a significant amount of horsepower to your workflow.

And just as an FYI on the horsepower of the PTHD Accel cards. With an HD|3 Accel I frequently max out the cards and run out of horsepower when mixing a song. I could probably use an HD4 or HD5 system and probably will upgrade to that in the future. AND!!! the TDM versions of the plugins that run on the HD cards instead of the host computer are more expensive than the RTAS plugins you already own. The TDM versions are about 2x the price of the RTAS version usually. So not only do you need to buy PTHD, but you will have to upgrade all your plugins to take advantage of the cards.

In terms of your question about the 192IO. It isn't the only option for HD. there is also the 96IO from Avid. But you also have other companies that make compatible interfaces. I believe the Apogee Rosetta200 is a stereo in, stereo out interface that can use their "X-HD" card (additional expense) to plug the rosetta200 into the PTHD cards.

Honestly, if i were in your situation, I would buy a new computer and live with the mbox for a little while longer and wait to see what new things avid releases for PTLE/Native processing in the next year.

[ballsd33p]

damn! how many plugs and tracks do you think it takes to max out a whole card? Ive read certain reverbs can take up a whole card - but what about regular instances of editing dynamics?

I know man.. I thought of it and I'd be willing to do that though bit by bit. But, with that being said if I were going to be spending that much money on plugins, why not just buy the real thing! If I'm going to process audio anyway, wouldn't it just make more sense to run the signal through an outboard piece of gear and record it?
Thats where the api 2500 comes in! -

Originally Posted by O.G. Killa

Honestly, if i were in your situation, I would buy a new computer and live with the mbox for a little while longer and wait to see what new things avid releases for PTLE/Native processing in the next year.

You know, I have been doing alot of research and I completely agree with you. With the new batch of processors and ram capabilities of pc's that have flooded the market, it seems like its just a stones throw away until pt can function on a 64-bit pc OS that utilizes more than 4 GB of ram. I actually saw an article on gearslutz that stated digi and microsoft had been working closely to update their product line..

You got any opinions on soundscape v.6, og?

[Shan]

Originally Posted by ballsd33p

yes.. no doubt a new computer would definitely aid in this situation. My computer now has an extremely outdated processor, but I'm running Xp SP3, 4gb ram, 2 TB sata HD's @ 7200rpm.

A Sandra report of your system will give us a more detailed look.

The point I was trying to get at though is that I'm mainly just going to be mixing and mastering - not recording groups (yet) - and personally I like the idea of having enough power to have all of my tracks up and running with inserts and plugins without processing 2/3 of the tracks before I've decided that something doesn't fit. Not to say that I don't do that now.. It's just that the guessing game gets very tedious.. I run alot of tracks with alot of plugins and I just need more power!

This is one of my smaller sessions running on an old Q6600 Quad at a buffer of 64. Insane native power is not an issue these days. On an i7, that CPU meter would be about 15%. That session would not run at all on an HD 1 or 2. It would struggle on an HD 3. An optimized system specifically set up for Pro Tools is something that still needs to be done whether you choose HD or LE.

Shane

[Shan]

Originally Posted by ballsd33p

damn! how many plugs and tracks do you think it takes to max out a whole card?

38 Dverbs per Accel card. 256 in total on an HD 7. Keep in mind the Mix engine used and the ADC will also eat into the DSP. An i7 with native alone is 543 at a buffer of 64. There is plenty of head room and overhead for the biggest mixes on a native rig. 1 Dverb is equal to a TON of regular plug-ins since it's quite the DSP/CPU pig. Dont forget, we can drop the new Intel 6 core CPU in our current i7 rigs. Add to that the Intel 8 core CPUs(16 cores with dual CPU's) which should be dropping any time soon, and there is no denying that native has surpassed the DSP solutions of yesteryear.

Shane