PT Issues

[lesbrunn]

Hey guys,

It's good to be back in this corner of the forum after so long. This is where I learned how to build the best PC for PT (20 years ago), and I'm still building them to this day.

There's a problem that brings me back here. I'd recently started having issues with PT from the last two versions, and I felt it wouldn't be a bad idea to upgrade to the latest hardware. I just built a new rig:

MSI Pro Z690 A, i913900k, 64gb Ripjaws DDR5 5600. I added my old M.2 drives (pcie 4 for Windows 11, audio, and samples) with a AIO 360 liquid cooler.

I was hoping to be able to handle larger sessions with lots of plugins much smoother than before, but I'm rather disappointed because although I'm running the system @ 5.6GHz all core, it seems to me PT will always be PT, and can handle (unlike many other DAWs) only a fraction of the money/hardware you throw at it.

Before I upgraded, I was using a Pro Z690 A DDR4/i712700k. I was running large sessions at a 64 buffer with no difficulty. Now that I have a more powerful system I've started seeing lots of 9173 errors, something I'd stopped encountering 3 or 4 years ago. I've done all the recommended optimizations. I've tested the RAM and reseated all the components.

So my questions go to folks who have similar systems to mine. Do you disable hyperthreading? I've always used hyperthreading very successfully though apparently it's not recommended. Are there other tweaks I should know about?
Why am I getting low cpu errors with a much more powerful system? I haven't been able to find any bad plugins. Before I upgraded I'd started having issues with PT launching smoothly. I'd sometimes have to start PT a couple of times before it launched properly. It's still happening, but in addition, I now have these 9173 errors. Any help would be most welcome. Thanks.

[junkgear]

The part I'm missing here is if you installed a new copy of Windows 11 and installed drivers, PT and plugins fresh or did you just swap your SSDs and let Windows find your new hardware?

As far as Hyperthreading goes, it's kind of a case by case basis. Since you are having issues, it's probably worth testing it both ways to see if it helps. I myself tend to find that I get better performance with a non hyperthreaded CPU.

Also when do you get the errors. Is it when you first play a session, randomly when the session is playing and you aren't doing anything else or when a session is playing and you open a plugin window? From there, is it a specific plugin?

[lesbrunn]

Originally Posted by junkgear

The part I'm missing here is if you installed a new copy of Windows 11 and installed drivers, PT and plugins fresh or did you just swap your SSDs and let Windows find your new hardware?

As far as Hyperthreading goes, it's kind of a case by case basis. Since you are having issues, it's probably worth testing it both ways to see if it helps. I myself tend to find that I get better performance with a non hyperthreaded CPU.

Also when do you get the errors. Is it when you first play a session, randomly when the session is playing and you aren't doing anything else or when a session is playing and you open a plugin window? From there, is it a specific plugin?

Hi junkgear,
It wasn't a new installation of Windows. The OS was already on an SSD. Sometimes the session doesn't open, and I have to try again. It all seems very random. I've troubleshooted for bad plugins, and no plugin seems to stand out.

[ejinbc]

L

Free Advice Alert.

Things I do for PT installs - that work for my application...

- When changing hardware I always start with a fresh reformat and install of Win.

- I set up as a dual boot system on the fastest M2 drive.

- One Win Boot partition is Online DAW (anything goes), the other partition is Offline-Always-DAW-Only.

- For the offline DAW partition, get Win 11 and PT installed, update WIN 11 (several times) and then disable all networking in the Device Manager - no WiFi, no Bluetooth, nada. If you use Eucon you'll need the Network Card.

- For the offline DAW partition, uninstall everything not related to the DAW, including PT Link and the PT online stuff. Also OneDrive and anything else that wants to look at the Network.

- Install all your plugins in offline mode (otherwise some of them will need the Network card enabled).

- For the offline install, disable all startup applications not related to the DAW.

- Do all the USB Power adjustments and other standard optimizations

- All updates to the offline DAW partition are done in offline mode. I don't update Windows 11 that often once its stable and happy.

- Much of the low latency performance will be influenced by the Driver for your interface, the plugins you use, and the structure of you mixes.

YMMV

ejinbc

[lesbrunn]

Originally Posted by ejinbc

L

Free Advice Alert.

Things I do for PT installs - that work for my application...

- When changing hardware I always start with a fresh reformat and install of Win.

- I set up as a dual boot system on the fastest M2 drive.

- One Win Boot partition is Online DAW (anything goes), the other partition is Offline-Always-DAW-Only.

- For the offline DAW partition, get Win 11 and PT installed, update WIN 11 (several times) and then disable all networking in the Device Manager - no WiFi, no Bluetooth, nada. If you use Eucon you'll need the Network Card.

- For the offline DAW partition, uninstall everything not related to the DAW, including PT Link and the PT online stuff. Also OneDrive and anything else that wants to look at the Network.

- Install all your plugins in offline mode (otherwise some of them will need the Network card enabled).

- For the offline install, disable all startup applications not related to the DAW.

- Do all the USB Power adjustments and other standard optimizations

- All updates to the offline DAW partition are done in offline mode. I don't update Windows 11 that often once its stable and happy.

- Much of the low latency performance will be influenced by the Driver for your interface, the plugins you use, and the structure of you mixes.

YMMV

ejinbc

Thanks for the insight. I might not go as far as that, but I have a backup of the session so I can always roll back. I was actually thinking of reinstalling everything but balked at the sheer number of plugins that have to be reinstalled. I agree, a clean install will straighten out all the kinks. 2 or 3 days spent fine-tuning a new installation is worth it in the long run; better than the constant frustration of things not working as they should.

[lesbrunn]

Originally Posted by ejinbc

L

Free Advice Alert.

Things I do for PT installs - that work for my application...

- When changing hardware I always start with a fresh reformat and install of Win.

Hey ejinbc,
Thanks for your input, it really makes a lot of sense to not confuse the OS with two very different hardware patterns... After a fresh install of Windows and everything else, PT is flying like an eagle. I'm now running an 85-track session at a 64 buffer with nary a hitch. Smooth as as baby's bottom, and i'm now beginning to appreciate the power of a 13th gen i9. It feels good!

[lesbrunn]

Hey guys, revisiting this thread...

After a fresh, clean installation of Windows, PT, and most of my plugins, there are no more 9173 errors. Plugin-loaded 85-95-track mix sessions at a 64 buffer are running smoothly and efficiently with 10-15% usage in the PT meter. For the first time since I started using PT, I have lots of power in reserve.

But I occasionally still have false starts when opening sessions. Not as frequently as before, but it shouldn't happen at all. All optimizations are in place, Windows is as it should be with regular maintenance, I've checked plugins and found nothing wrong there... could some of them be 'secretly' incompatible without declaring themselves in the plugin troubleshooting/filtering process?

What are the symptoms of hyperthreading issues, anyone?

Any suggestions anyone? Thanks, guys, for all the previous help!

[albee1952]

Hyperthreading is a case by case thing with no definitive answer. You have to try it on and off and see if either is better for your rig. Even nearly identical systems can be a tossup for that setting

[lesbrunn]

Originally Posted by albee1952

Hyperthreading is a case by case thing with no definitive answer. You have to try it on and off and see if either is better for your rig. Even nearly identical systems can be a tossup for that setting

Thanks, Dave. I've used it successfully since I started building PCs, but I guess I'll have to test it thoroughly on this system. The system runs fine though. I'm just worried about my session startup issue.

[ejinbc]

LB

One more thing....

I was pretty happy with the performance of my 13900K system, but every so often I was still getting pop/clicks, but at odd intervals and only after about 2 minutes of clear operation. Argh !

Turns out I forgot to turn off the background file indexing. In Win 11 the system indexes files and contents - I have a large number of files across several drives.

After turning off the indexing - for each drive - all is great again in DAWland. Clearly each little optimization contributes to a stable, low latency, system.

YMMV

ejinbc

PS

The guys at BlueCat Audio have published a list of computer optimizations for DAW work. Might be worth a review. Just FYI.

https://gearspace.com/board/music-co...s-laptops.html