Problems Using 2 RME Fireface 800's

[bloodsnake2]

Hello. I have searched this forum as a non-member but I feel my problem is too exact so I've joined. I am trying to use two rme800s for 16 analog ins and outs. So far I can only get 12 analog outs. I've narrowed this down to Pro Tools 12, I believe.

I'm using two RME Fireface 800s on my MacBook Pro (mid 2015, 2.2 ghz intel core i7, 16gb ram) via Firewire 400 > thunderbolt adapter/thunderbolt port on the computer. I've got my RMEs hooked up like this:

thunderbolt port > thunderbolt to firewire 800 adapter > firewire 800 to firewire 400 cable > firewire 400 port on 1st RME800

firewire 800 from 1st RME800 > 2nd RME800 firewire 800 port

and I've got the WORD OUT of the 1st RME into the WORD IN of the 2nd RME, with the blue 75 button pressed in on the 2nd RME.

---

I've been using 12 outs for a while but would really like the other 4. Everything for the 4 outs is set up the same as the 12. I just don't understand what could be going on. I'm kinda new to this computer set up and its driving me crazy not being able to understand what the problem is/could be. I've tried switching it so the thunderbolt is going to a firewire 800 > 800 cable, using the firewire 800>400 cable to connect the two RMEs but its all still the same. When I'm playing audio through outs 1-12, they show up in TotalMix, but once I select 13 or 14 they just stop showing up. Again, like I said, everything is the same for these 4 tracks.

Any help would be greatly appreciated

[Trainwreckmusic]

You might get more responses at the RME comunity. Good luck RME FF800 are great piece of gear but the Total Mix Fx has a very steep learning curve👹 There are some good toutorial videos available that explain how to link 2 FF 800 units together . Hope this helps. TWM

[Glazik]

Hello, & happy new year.

Could you post some pics of Totalmix, and Pro Toos I/O windows please ?

Everything is fine in your set up, and this issue is probably software related. Are your 13 to 16 outputs in Loopback mode ?

[demodigi]

@ bloodsnake2
Pro Tools is limited to 32 I/O with Core Audio (or ASIO) interfaces.

If I understand you're setup, you are using an aggregate device (the 2 FF800 are combined into 1 interface in the AMS).

FF800 has a total of 28 I/O. So the total I/O count of the aggregate device is 56I/O.

While Pro Tools may still show all 56I/O, it will actually send (or receive) audio only into the first Out1-32 (or In1-32) so :
- 1-28 of the 1st FF800 1-28 (does include ADAT and SPDIF I/O)
- 29-32 of the 2nd FF800 1-4
- the remaining 5-28 channels of the 2nd FF800 are muted

The best way to use 16 analog I/O is to connect the 2nd FF800 unit into the 1st FF800 unit using ADAT cables (ADAT out (1st unit)-> ADAT In (2nd Unit)).
- On the 1st FF800 unit, route Playback 1-8 to Analog 1-8, and route Playback 9-16 to ADAT Outs 1-8.
- You must use FW800 with the 2nd FF800 unit with FW800 to the mac only to change you're setup with the TM FX (route ADAT Ins 1-8 -> Analog Outs 1-8), store your settings then disconnect the FW800.
- In PT use Output 1-16 as analog outputs (don't take care about the default labels (with digital I/O), use you're own labels). NB : PT "sees" the Playback output of the TM FX, not the physical ones.
- You can keep using Wordclock attached for the sync (1st unit WC Out->2nd Unit WC In, too).

EDIT : I think, you can even use more than 16 Analog Outs if you're using the 2 ADAT ports (up to 20 Analog Outs by using the headphones Outs)

[bloodsnake2]

Hey yall. Sorry about the late response. Here are some shots of my TotalMix matrices, mixers, RME settings, and pro tools i/o and busses. Hope this helps. I have some ADAT cables coming in the mail that should be here next week so I can try out the other way that was mentioned. Thanks a lot !


EDIT:
Got the ADAT cables today and still can't get them to work. I followed Demodigi's advice, though some of it is confusing. Is this a software problem like Glazik sez?

Thanks

[bloodsnake2]

What does one do in the case that it is a software problem?

[demodigi]

1/ You should NOT use an Aggregate device as Pro Tools Playback Engine but use only (1) FF800 interface. Use Fireface 800 coreaudio driver of the 1st FF800. Pro Tools should only "see" 28 channels of this interface (not 56).

2/ The routing must be done in the Totalmix FX for each FF800, NOT in Pro Tools.

Note : the settings in the screenshots are NOT correct :
FF800-1 :
In Fireface Setting : Bandwidth limit should be set to ALL (or Analog+SPDIF+ADAT), for the moment you only get 12 I/O instead of 28 I/O.

In Totalmix FX :
- All inputs should be set to "-INF" (those are for monitoring only, the input signals are DIRECTLY sent into Pro Tools)
- Playback 1-8 should be routed to Analog Out 1-8
[EDIT]
- Playback 13-20 should be routed to ADAT Out 1-8 (to route 8 additional PT's outputs to the 1st ADAT Out port)
(you can use PB 9-16 if you want, but it might be confusing later)
Note : PB9-10 is for the Headphone, PB11-12 is for SPDIF
There is still a strange stuff in the Pro Tools screenshot about the channel array (Analog should be 1-10 and NOT 1-11 / SPDIF should be 11-12 and NOT 12-13 / Optical 13-28 and NOT 14-28)
[/EDIT]

FF800-2 :
- All Analog inputs should be set to -inf
- Analog IN 1-8 should be routed to ADAT Out 1-8 (to sent 8 Analog In into Pro Tools)
- ADAT IN 1-8 should be routed to Analog Out 1-8 ( to sent 8 additional Pro Tools' outputs to your outboard).
=> save the settings in the internal memory (I think it is automatic, but I don't know how the FF800 actually works => in TMFX, "Option" menu -> Store Current State into Device).

3/ Once the Routing of each FF800 is done, disconnect the FW cable of the 2nd FF800 (the signal will go through ADAT ports).

4/ Back into Pro Tools :
- ADAT1-8 In (channel 14 to 21) will be used for the 8 additional Analog Input of the FF800-2
- ADAT1-8 Out (channel 14 to 21) will be used for the 8 additional Analog Outputs of the FF800-2
- Like you already did, you can still rename you busses to label ADAT1-8 into Output 9-16 (or whatever)

Hope it's not confusing anymore

[mesaone]

And keep the WC cable how you had it - Interface one WC out to interface 2 WC in, with terminator engaged on interface 2. That way you can change samplerate from within totalmix, and both interfaces will follow.

[demodigi]

And keep the WC cable how you had it - Interface one WC out to interface 2 WC in, with terminator engaged on interface 2. That way you can change samplerate from within totalmix, and both interfaces will follow.

+1

[mesaone]

Sorry, I made a mistake - sample rate is changed from the control panel, not TotalMix. Same deal with the cables though