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  #1  
Old 06-27-2010, 09:26 PM
zepiqueno zepiqueno is offline
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Default 003 ,neumann mic????

okay i just ordered a neumann tlm 102 anyone used this mic anygood?,main question tho,with the digi 003 when recording do i need any pre amps or anything or just run the mic straight in and use the eq and compresser in pro tools\? thanks guys ,new to this forum by the way
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  #2  
Old 06-27-2010, 10:19 PM
Sparky1 Sparky1 is offline
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Default Re: 003 ,neumann mic????

The TLM 102 is a condenser microphone and requires phantom power to work - which is available on your 003. Nice pre amps will change the way the mic sounds - often for the better...

Sparky
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  #3  
Old 06-28-2010, 01:06 AM
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chrisdee chrisdee is offline
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Default Re: 003 ,neumann mic????

You don't need a preamp. Your 003 has 4 of them built in. I would rather spend money on another mic than buying a preamp. The preamps in the 003 are pretty good. I'v had several preamps ($3000+ high end ones), but could not hear any improvement in sound quality comparing to my Mbox 2 Pro (same preamps as 003).
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  #4  
Old 06-28-2010, 01:11 AM
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DrFord DrFord is offline
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Default Re: 003 ,neumann mic????

Neumann TLM 102 is a fantastic mic and a great "starter" vocal mic. By "starter" I mean a smaller investment with great sound for the dollar. Later on you may find you want to purchase a vintage $10,000+ microphone, which would not be considered a "starter" mic because of the pricetag. Also this is a modern mic which has a few advantages as far as parts / maintenance / support.

As this is not a tube driven mic you will most likely find it clear and sometimes may be a bit "sterile" or "cold." This is of course absolutely dependent on what you are recording. However since this mic does not have a tube, you may want to invest in a tubed Mic Pre. I have the Avalon 737sp which has 4 tubes in it, and I bet the pair of your mic and my pre would sound pretty nice on a vocal. I have also heard in many situation that this mic sounds better then many at twice it's cost.

In the future you may find that purchasing a matched pair of neumann mics is a great idea as you can set them up as stereo room mics when recording drums / orchestra / brass / choir / foley / Acoustic Guitars really anything can benefit from being recorded in stereo by a nice matched pair.

You next purchase should be 2 small diaphragm condensers for instrument recordings. A great starter set would be the KM series. Definitely buy a matched pair.

http://www.neumann.com/?lang=en&id=c...80_description

Try before you buy, I always recommend sweetwater.com for pro purchases because they are simply the cheapest period, and have a money back satisfaction guarantee. Joe Secu is my guy. Tell him I sent you.

Seriously everything I buy is from sweetwater except quick purchases from Guitar center or other local resellers.

best,
Doc
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  #5  
Old 06-28-2010, 06:04 AM
BradLyons BradLyons is offline
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Default Re: 003 ,neumann mic????

I disagree about buying another mic before buying a preamp for the TLM102. While the pres on the 003 are "okay", they are just that.... "okay". It's not just possible---but likely that one could plug another micpre into the 003's converters and not hear a significant change, because the converters won't allow you to really hear the differences. The pres in the 003 aren't meant to be high-end, and they certainly aren't...they are useable, but there is a major difference between the built-in pre and even a $600 Grace 101 mic-pre. Depending upon the pre, it will also have its own sound---and of course depending upon the microphone. I'm not sure why you were not able to hear the differences in pres on your MBOx2Pro v/s that of $3,000 pres....again my guess is you were using the built-in converters, but there are worlds of differences. If there were not, I would have sold off the pres I own and replace them with MBOX2Pros's ;-)
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Old 06-28-2010, 06:10 AM
therecordinghouse therecordinghouse is offline
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Default Re: 003 ,neumann mic????

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisdee View Post
I'v had several preamps ($3000+ high end ones), but could not hear any improvement in sound quality comparing to my Mbox 2 Pro (same preamps as 003).
you may need some new monitors.


seriously though, the 003 preamps are "usable". i would not spend any money on new preamps until you know what the deficiencies of the 003 pres are.
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  #7  
Old 06-28-2010, 08:16 AM
Neale Neale is offline
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Default Re: 003 ,neumann mic????

If you don't even know how to plug in your mic, I would humbly suggest you don't spend any more money before you figure out what you already have.

If you buy a new mic preamp, you will undoubtedly find that the mic sounds "different". Better or worse is subjective. Having said that, as one poster mentioned, while the 003r preamps are "usable", there are likely other bits of kit that will have you believing it sounds "better". Beware of the fact that anytime you buy a new piece of gear there's a honeymoon period, where you may be trying to justify to yourself that it was worth the purchase, or that it sounds "different" and you qualify that as "better" to justify your purchase.

Try taking the mic to a proper studio, if there's one in your area. See if you can rent other pieces of gear - like preamps - and see if your recordings really do change "for the better" before you drop some dough on other stuff. Remember that once you get to a certain price point, you will end up spending a few thousand dollars on a box, but that you will also be able to probably sell/trade that box for 70%+ of its original price if you take care of it, assuming that it's a "quality" box. If you spend $300 on a preamp, good luck getting $150 for it later if you decide that it's not what you remembered from your honeymoon.

As for tube "warmth", sorry, that's crap. Neves aren't "tubed" and they are generally considered "warm". A Summit DCL-200 has lots of tubes but is a "clean" compressor. And that's not a "sales pitch" - that's from someone who uses them. A great tube design with a lot of headroom can be very clean, and a great solid-state design with certain transformers can be warm. Betcha the Avalon "warmth" the previous posted mentioned comes more from its transformer(s) more than its tubes. Different preamps WILL sound different, though - but learn a lot more about your ears before you judge a piece of gear on the basis of it having "tubes" or not.

Beyond that, we've got a $10k mic here at the studio I work at. I prefer our $400 AT-4033 on my voice over that one. Michael Jackson used an SM-7 on the Thriller album (well, Bruce Swedien was the engineer anyway), and that goes for about $350 these days. "More expensive" doesn't absolutely mean "better", it just means "more expensive". It's amazing how good cheap gear sounds when someone talented is singing/playing into it, and a great mic will NOT automatically make you sound better.

And in the end...

Art is never completed, it is just abandoned.
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  #8  
Old 06-28-2010, 08:58 AM
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Keybeeetsss Keybeeetsss is offline
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Default Re: 003 ,neumann mic????

Quote:
Originally Posted by BradLyons View Post
I disagree about buying another mic before buying a preamp for the TLM102. While the pres on the 003 are "okay", they are just that.... "okay". It's not just possible---but likely that one could plug another micpre into the 003's converters and not hear a significant change, because the converters won't allow you to really hear the differences. The pres in the 003 aren't meant to be high-end, and they certainly aren't...they are useable, but there is a major difference between the built-in pre and even a $600 Grace 101 mic-pre. Depending upon the pre, it will also have its own sound---and of course depending upon the microphone. I'm not sure why you were not able to hear the differences in pres on your MBOx2Pro v/s that of $3,000 pres....again my guess is you were using the built-in converters, but there are worlds of differences. If there were not, I would have sold off the pres I own and replace them with MBOX2Pros's ;-)
Quote:
Originally Posted by therecordinghouse View Post
you may need some new monitors.


seriously though, the 003 preamps are "usable". i would not spend any money on new preamps until you know what the deficiencies of the 003 pres are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neale View Post
If you don't even know how to plug in your mic, I would humbly suggest you don't spend any more money before you figure out what you already have.

If you buy a new mic preamp, you will undoubtedly find that the mic sounds "different". Better or worse is subjective. Having said that, as one poster mentioned, while the 003r preamps are "usable", there are likely other bits of kit that will have you believing it sounds "better". Beware of the fact that anytime you buy a new piece of gear there's a honeymoon period, where you may be trying to justify to yourself that it was worth the purchase, or that it sounds "different" and you qualify that as "better" to justify your purchase.

Try taking the mic to a proper studio, if there's one in your area. See if you can rent other pieces of gear - like preamps - and see if your recordings really do change "for the better" before you drop some dough on other stuff. Remember that once you get to a certain price point, you will end up spending a few thousand dollars on a box, but that you will also be able to probably sell/trade that box for 70%+ of its original price if you take care of it, assuming that it's a "quality" box. If you spend $300 on a preamp, good luck getting $150 for it later if you decide that it's not what you remembered from your honeymoon.

As for tube "warmth", sorry, that's crap. Neves aren't "tubed" and they are generally considered "warm". A Summit DCL-200 has lots of tubes but is a "clean" compressor. And that's not a "sales pitch" - that's from someone who uses them. A great tube design with a lot of headroom can be very clean, and a great solid-state design with certain transformers can be warm. Betcha the Avalon "warmth" the previous posted mentioned comes more from its transformer(s) more than its tubes. Different preamps WILL sound different, though - but learn a lot more about your ears before you judge a piece of gear on the basis of it having "tubes" or not.

Beyond that, we've got a $10k mic here at the studio I work at. I prefer our $400 AT-4033 on my voice over that one. Michael Jackson used an SM-7 on the Thriller album (well, Bruce Swedien was the engineer anyway), and that goes for about $350 these days. "More expensive" doesn't absolutely mean "better", it just means "more expensive". It's amazing how good cheap gear sounds when someone talented is singing/playing into it, and a great mic will NOT automatically make you sound better.

And in the end...

Art is never completed, it is just abandoned.
I agree with all this...
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  #9  
Old 06-28-2010, 09:19 AM
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TOM@METRO TOM@METRO is offline
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Default Re: 003 ,neumann mic????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keybeeetsss View Post
I agree with all this...
Same here.
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  #10  
Old 06-28-2010, 09:55 AM
bigdrum2 bigdrum2 is offline
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Default Re: 003 ,neumann mic????

I got a pair ( TLM 102 ) and use it for OH's and they are great. if you can't
make good recording with those, the problem is not the mic.......
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