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  #1  
Old 10-27-2003, 08:29 PM
davidp158 davidp158 is offline
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Default off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

I hope no one minds a non-ProTools software/hardware question.

I am about to record a bluegrass band and wonder which of the microphones I have would work best. I don't know the exact instrumentation, but I assume its guitar, mandolin, upright bass, and possibly dobro and/or banjo. The band wants to record live in the studio, but record vocals as an overdub. They are not sure if solos will be performed live, or as overdubs, yet.

Here's what I have for mics:

AT 4050 (omni, cardioid, or figure 8)
Shure KSM32
Blue Baby Bottle
Studio Projects C1
Studio Projects B3 (omni, cardioid, or figure 8)
(2) Oktava MC012
(2) Rode NT3
AKG D112
(2) Shure SM57
Shure Beta 57
(2) Shure Beta 58
Shure SM58

I was thinking about doing a mid-side stereo recording of the band (AT4050 for side, KSM32, or other, for mid), and then close miking the bass and soloists. I don't have a matched pair of large diaphram condensers, so I'm not sure about a stereo recording instead of the mid-side technique. I have used the Oktava MC012's and Rode NT3's as stereo pairs, but both tend to be a bit spikey and harsh.

Will the mid-side plus close mikes present more phase problems than if I just close mike each instrument? What about recording overdubs so that they sound like they are in the same room/space? I haven't recorded with mid-side, yet.

This is a new type of band for me to record, so any info you can offer would be greatly appreciated.

thanks in advance,
Dave
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  #2  
Old 10-27-2003, 10:58 PM
Naagzh Naagzh is offline
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Default Re: off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

I usually do the garage band thing myself, but once I recorded a wedding trio making a demo in order to give to brides. Anyways, I set them up in the nicest, biggest, best-sounding room in the house, stuck a 57 on the violin, a 57 on the viola, and a 421 on the cello. Sounded like crap.

So I stuck two condensers in the room about 8 feet away in an XY pattern, and used the close micing just to touch up the tone and balance out the levels. Things were getting better but then I told them to PLAY INTO the stereo mic pair. Actually VISUALIZE the music going into those mics. I swear the performances and the sound got much better.

So that's my "fish out of water" story. Gleam what you will.

Definitely use your best 2 large diaphragm condensers as your stereo mics, and close-mic with 57s or your other more directional mics (however, I suggest you don't point the mics directly at the sound holes on the instruments, because you may get proximity effect, and your levels may peak too easily). Experiment with different setups in the room. Mid/side is good, but you'll hear it when the mics are in a good spot. Also, I suggest you try the D112 on the upright bass, just to hear it. If it sounds good, try a large diaphragm mic just to compare.

Also, if you have enough channels, set up a room mic in an adjacent room around the corner or some other place, for a softer room sound. You may be able to use this track as a natural reverb. Use a mic with its high pass filter engaged (the KSM32 has one I think).

Naagzh
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Old 10-27-2003, 11:30 PM
Paul Cavins Paul Cavins is offline
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Default Re: off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

When I've seen bluegrass bands, they've all gathered around a large diaphragm condenser mic (or an x-y pair) and then came forward and stepped back as solos came and went. I don't know how high-tech your clients would want to sound, but a good bluegrass band can make this setup work well, and I think it is more "authentic" in the historical sense (not that it should really matter).


Good luck-sounds fun

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Old 10-28-2003, 01:43 AM
mindnoise mindnoise is offline
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Default Re: off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

BTW: There are violins and guitars in the band?
Don´t record digital! record to studio tape first. Or you will have those "buzzing" on the high freq. bands.

best
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Old 10-28-2003, 04:32 AM
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Will Russell Will Russell is offline
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Default Re: off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

Quote:
TW: There are violins and guitars in the band?
Don´t record digital! record to studio tape first. Or you will have those "buzzing" on the high freq. bands.


Oh please. Digital is fine for violins and guitars. I do it all the time.
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Old 10-28-2003, 05:14 AM
where02190 where02190 is offline
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Default Re: off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

Actually for bluegrass it wouldn't be called a violin, it would be called a fiddle.

You will not have any problems recording digitally that would won't have going analog, disregard that rather ignorant post regarding buzzing and digital.

A traditional bluegrass sound would utilize one mic, your Audio Technica. You will have of course basically no phase issues with one mic, and if the band knows their positioning well, it will be a simple job. You'll need a very good sounding room as well.
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Old 10-28-2003, 07:54 AM
johnnyreno johnnyreno is offline
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Default Re: off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

Steve Earle and the Del Mccoury band did an album together a couple of years ago. One large diaghram mic set to Omni for both the recording and the live tour. Rock on and post some samples when you're done please! Peace.
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Old 10-28-2003, 09:21 AM
Anthemmusic Anthemmusic is offline
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Default Re: off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

Quote:
When I've seen bluegrass bands, they've all gathered around a large diaphragm condenser mic (or an x-y pair) and then came forward and stepped back as solos came and went. I don't know how high-tech your clients would want to sound, but a good bluegrass band can make this setup work well, and I think it is more "authentic" in the historical sense (not that it should really matter).

This is how I've heard Bluegrass, also. If they've been at it a while, they should know about this technique of working the mic. I think it will sound more raw and compliment the genre of music. You may want to get that mic on the bass, though.
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Old 10-28-2003, 09:44 AM
athlone athlone is offline
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Default Re: off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

It depends how they are used to performing and how good they are at it. If they generally multi-mic on stage, a session is not the time to learn how to balance. Note important comment above about the sound of the room. You'll hear a lot of room with one mic or pair.
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Old 10-28-2003, 01:06 PM
C-TOWNsound C-TOWNsound is offline
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Default Re: off topic - bluegrass band mic uses

I think a lot of the old bluegrass records were done with a ribbon mic in the center of the ensemble. too bad you don't have one of those.
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