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  #91  
Old 06-20-2024, 12:09 PM
skylar_battles skylar_battles is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

Incredibly disappointing...

I should probably revert to 2023.12.1.

I hope this get's fixed by 2024.9. It's unusable.
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Last edited by skylar_battles; 06-20-2024 at 12:20 PM.
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  #92  
Old 06-20-2024, 12:27 PM
innerbooty innerbooty is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

This is such a total bummer. I only just upgraded to 2024.3.1, mostly so I could update the firmware in my HDX card. But I am going to be needing to do a ton of MIDI tracking soon. Is 2024.3.1 significantly worse than 2023.12.1?? Should I downgrade? I've never gone backwards before. I hope it's not too hard to do!
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  #93  
Old 06-20-2024, 01:29 PM
strawb strawb is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

just worked with Manuel at AVID tech support
we ended up rolling back to 2023.12.1
had to trash the DSI prefs first.

i really hope avid can figure this one out asap
because 2024.6 did WORK just not with recording midi.
and the ARA auto Align 2 was GLORIOUS on drums
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  #94  
Old 06-20-2024, 03:40 PM
skylar_battles skylar_battles is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

Wondering if anyone can clarify this for me. Does PT-262860 encompass MIDI being placed incorrectly on the timeline as related to the hardware buffer size and/or also address the delay compensation issue where adding any plugins to a session causes VI playback after recording to not sound as it did during recording? I’d really love to see the report of possible. I don’t understand how new MIDI features can be added with this glaring bug that makes MIDI unusable in these versions.
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  #95  
Old 06-20-2024, 05:25 PM
Dizzi45Z Dizzi45Z is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

Quote:
Originally Posted by strawb View Post
trying to record midi/instrument track to click.
all good until you add ANY PLUGIN to the session.

here's the video

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1e656yefp2...0PTHD.mov?dl=0
I recreated your exact scenario and I'm not having the same issue. There must be something that is different between your sessions and mine that is adding to this issue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H439bBDC9jg
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  #96  
Old 06-21-2024, 09:13 AM
strawb strawb is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dizzi45Z View Post
I recreated your exact scenario and I'm not having the same issue. There must be something that is different between your sessions and mine that is adding to this issue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H439bBDC9jg
thanks for the vid.
it's obviously not happening to everyone
my studio rig is mac studio monterey 12.7.5
sonnet thunderbolt chassis with HDX card
antelope galaxy 64 interface

my home rig is a MBP monterey 12.7.5
no HDX
UA Volt interface
everything works fine on the home rig - studio rig is wacked. maybe its HDX? or antelope or who knows?
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  #97  
Old 06-21-2024, 10:32 AM
innerbooty innerbooty is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

I have no idea if this will be relevant to anyone, because I am (only very recently) on 2024.3.1. So this is not 2024.6, and this is my first attempt at using MIDI in 2024.3.1. But I just setup an HDX card in a Sonnett chassis. And I have an Apollo x4 here too. (M1 Studio Ultra / Ventura) So I was very curious to try these tests on my setup, to see if I would need to go back to 2023.12.1, as some people seem to be doing. I did the exact tests in the posted videos, in a brand new PT session. I also did the exact same tests using HDX as the Playback Engine and using UA Thunderbolt. I also used an Instrument track for the Xpand2 drums, as well as an Aux track. I had zero timing issues under any scenario (beyond my own inability to play exactly with the click). I had the Buffer = 64, but also did a couple of final tests at 512. I don't have AutoTune anymore, so for the ADC plugin I used the Weiss De-Esser (2600 sample delay) When that was working fine I tried the DS1-Mk3 with 8000 samples of delay. No timing issues with recorded MIDI for either, and no noticeable lag when recording the MIDI.

However, over the last few months I have totally been wrestling with MIDI lag issues in 2023.12.1 in a much larger audiobook session, with lots of VI's, and Aux sends on many of the VI tracks, and the Weiss De-Esser on several of the VO tracks. I soon realized I had to deactivate all the De-Esser instances in order to track MIDI with terrible delay. But at least in this simple session, it's all working for me, on HDX and Apollo.

Quick Followup: While I had this all going I went ahead and added an Aux send on the Xpand2 Aux track, pointing to a Relab LX480 v2 (which says only 17 samples of delay. Can that be right?) With the Weiss Aux track active, MIDI was totally unplayable - terrible lag - when the Aux/Instrument track had a send to the LX480. Yikes!!! This was obviously what I was experiencing last spring in 2023.12.1, and is certainly not fixed as of 2024.3.1, and corroborates what was mentioned above.
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Last edited by innerbooty; 06-21-2024 at 10:46 AM.
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  #98  
Old 06-21-2024, 07:32 PM
skylar_battles skylar_battles is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

Thanks for your response!

Just did some more testing…

In a session with an instrument track, an audio track with 5 Auto Tune Pros, and a click track, recording MIDI on an instrument track is fine until…

I add a send to a reverb! In this case, just adding a send to Little Plate makes the VI completely unplayable due to the incredible amount of latency induced, you are correct

Tested on 2024.6

And FWIW, even though in most cases th e user wants MIDI latency from the buffer size to be printed so playback sounds identical to recording, would an exception be recording the MIDI output of hardware synths?

If you have a workflow where you record the audio and MIDI output simultaneously from a hardware synth, and then use the unedited MIDI data from your performance to send out to another synth or V to create layers of textures, wouldn’t the user not want the MIDI latency printed from the buffer size in this situation? I’m trying to wrap my head around this because it seems there may be cases like this which me less to believe the setting should be toggleable at the track level which the user might want to change if they are triggering VIs with MIDI controllers vs. the situation I described.
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Last edited by skylar_battles; 06-21-2024 at 09:11 PM.
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  #99  
Old 06-22-2024, 06:31 AM
innerbooty innerbooty is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

Hopefully this MIDI track Aux send latency issue can be become it's own specific Avid case. It seems to span multiple versions. Avid Support? Anyone? Although, it's still not clear why Strawb is having latency issues on his HDX rig - without Aux sends - but not on his home UAD rig. Be good to figure that out.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't understand why we can't get a version of Pro Tools MIDI where ADC works such that what you hear is what you get, which is also what appears in the MIDI recorded track. Just like regular recorded audio (except when it's all messed up in Hybrid Mode...)

Makes me nostalgic for my old DP days of having racks of outboard hardware and keyboards that just worked, and played back the way you heard them.

(EDIT: I also wonder why so few people are chiming in on this thread? Is MIDI just working perfectly for most people out there? Or have they just resigned themselves to all the workarounds you need to make it work, which is what I've been doing for years now)
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  #100  
Old 06-22-2024, 11:57 AM
Dave S. Dave S. is offline
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Default Re: PT 2024.3 NEW issue MIDI LATENCY

Quote:
Originally Posted by innerbooty View Post
Hopefully this MIDI track Aux send latency issue can be become it's own specific Avid case. It seems to span multiple versions. Avid Support? Anyone? Although, it's still not clear why Strawb is having latency issues on his HDX rig - without Aux sends - but not on his home UAD rig. Be good to figure that out.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't understand why we can't get a version of Pro Tools MIDI where ADC works such that what you hear is what you get, which is also what appears in the MIDI recorded track. Just like regular recorded audio (except when it's all messed up in Hybrid Mode...)

Makes me nostalgic for my old DP days of having racks of outboard hardware and keyboards that just worked, and played back the way you heard them.

(EDIT: I also wonder why so few people are chiming in on this thread? Is MIDI just working perfectly for most people out there? Or have they just resigned themselves to all the workarounds you need to make it work, which is what I've been doing for years now)
Midi is definitely not working correctly in a lot of ways for a lot of people. There’s a lot of threads about it. Like you said, most people are resigned to the workarounds or I’m guessing they’re simply not using ProTools if their music requires a lot of midi.

I’ve had problems with ProTools not delay compensating external synths correctly. Avid has been aware of this for a long time and their weak solution is the midi offset delay preference. It’s almost like they’re saying “maybe you can figure it out. Enter a number and find out.” My set up is dead simple, no other plug-ins, no sends or auxes, everything direct out to the master. I still have to manually correct midi timing.

I have an open support case for another delay/synth pedal that will only tempo sync to ProTools if it starts from the beginning of the session. So yeah, lots of midi problems, past and present.

My problems are primarily with external midi devices. I also use superior drummer, but have no problems with it.

Avid does seem to have made improvements in the last few years with customer service and some of their policies but I think they would be wise to make it a top priority to fix all midi and delay compensation issues. Nothing else matters if protools makes it difficult to create music. I would never recommend ProTools for anybody who deals with a lot of MIDI.

Really hope Avid’s new ownership makes this a priority.
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