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  #1  
Old 04-11-2010, 04:36 PM
filmsdunjour filmsdunjour is offline
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Default BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

Hi everyone,
I've just installed a BlackMagic Intensity Pro on Pro Tools HD 8.0.3 system (macpro 2007, 2,66 4 cores).
Monitoring HD sources looks perfect (Apple ProRes 422) but SD sucks (DV or ProsRes), I see blocky images and terrible de-interleaving.
In Final Cut Pro, I have to choose the right output setting, fitting the video format I use, for the card to output video correctly.
In my case, I have to use the HDTV 1080i50 setting for HD and PAL 50 for SD and then everything's fine.
I know all DeckLinks card behave that way, so as there's no such setting in ProTools, how do you guys monitor SD video with your Decklink?
I don't want to waste my time and my disk space transcoding all my SD videos to HD, this is not suitable. Most of my SD projects are the ones I have to work on very fast...
Keeping a Canopus for SD playback is my option for now, but it's frustrating as the Decklink cards handle very well SD video... in Final Cut pro...
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  #2  
Old 04-11-2010, 05:21 PM
diamondschwin diamondschwin is online now
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Default Re: BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

Have you checked the black magic control panel in sys preferences, especially un checking the remove field jitter option?

the black magic card is the only thing doing QuickTime of any resolution well For me. So I'm surprised.
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  #3  
Old 04-12-2010, 02:13 AM
filmsdunjour filmsdunjour is offline
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Default Re: BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

Quote:
Originally Posted by diamondschwin View Post
Have you checked the black magic control panel in sys preferences, especially un checking the remove field jitter option?

the black magic card is the only thing doing QuickTime of any resolution well For me. So I'm surprised.
Thanks I'll try, but this option is supposed to remove field jitter on stop.
My main problem is that the SD images are very blocky and "not fluid" (sorry for my english) on the video-projector, using either composite (YC in fact) or HDMI output.
The same movies played through the Canopus on the same video-projector are a bit blur but fluid and I don't see big blocks.
The down-conversion options don't change anything.
Are you using PAL or NTSC?
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  #4  
Old 04-12-2010, 05:54 AM
diamondschwin diamondschwin is online now
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Default Re: BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

Ntsc mostly.
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  #5  
Old 04-12-2010, 07:48 AM
diamondschwin diamondschwin is online now
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Default Re: BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

I know it says field jitter on stop but theres a tech document where digi says to turn it off because its unsupported for pro tools or something along those lines.


it makes jagged or blocky edges and bad interlacing artifacts during playback. which is sort of what you are saying you see.
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  #6  
Old 04-12-2010, 08:44 AM
filmsdunjour filmsdunjour is offline
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Default Re: BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

Quote:
Originally Posted by diamondschwin View Post
I know it says field jitter on stop but theres a tech document where digi says to turn it off because its unsupported for pro tools or something along those lines.


it makes jagged or blocky edges and bad interlacing artifacts during playback. which is sort of what you are saying you see.
Thanks, I hadn't seen the tech note.
As I'm on my first day of holyday, I'll try next week and let you know, hoping to add "fixed" to this thread's header.
I hope this is not a PAL issue.
Thanks for your time...

Clement
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  #7  
Old 04-19-2010, 12:15 PM
filmsdunjour filmsdunjour is offline
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Default Re: BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

Quote:
Originally Posted by diamondschwin View Post
I know it says field jitter on stop but theres a tech document where digi says to turn it off because its unsupported for pro tools or something along those lines.


it makes jagged or blocky edges and bad interlacing artifacts during playback. which is sort of what you are saying you see.
I turned off "field jitter on stop".
I don't see no more terrible image artifacts during camera moves but I still see jerked deinterlacing.
The image's still terribly aliased, it reminds me of old times mixing with cinepack quicktime tracks.
The canopus image looks so much better!
I tried both HDMI and S-Video outputs, DV PAL (lower field) or Apple ProRes codec (upper field).
1080i50 Apple ProRes looks perfect...

Anyone else working in SD PAL with a Blackmagic?
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  #8  
Old 04-19-2010, 03:19 PM
Gary Nattrass Gary Nattrass is offline
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Default Re: BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

I use this card but mainly for HD from my panasonic cameras at 1920x1080i 25np but all the DV SD material I have shows the problems you are also having.

I do find that for LCD or DLP projectors or screens that progressive material is best in HD or SD.

It may be that the pro res you have is 1080i 25p or 50p progressive and that your canopus is de-intelacing the DV SD as it is a budget interface, I have a formac firewire converter and that too was Ok for all my DV SD video but since I went to the blackmagic it shows the same problems that you have.

Use Mpeg streamclip or quicktime to de-interlace or make your SD material into progressive, this is what I used to do with my HDV material and I made 1920x1080i 25p pro res files for dubbing.

http://www.squared5.com/
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  #9  
Old 04-19-2010, 04:39 PM
filmsdunjour filmsdunjour is offline
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Default Re: BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Nattrass View Post
I use this card but mainly for HD from my panasonic cameras at 1920x1080i 25np but all the DV SD material I have shows the problems you are also having.

I do find that for LCD or DLP projectors or screens that progressive material is best in HD or SD.

It may be that the pro res you have is 1080i 25p or 50p progressive and that your canopus is de-intelacing the DV SD as it is a budget interface, I have a formac firewire converter and that too was Ok for all my DV SD video but since I went to the blackmagic it shows the same problems that you have.

Use Mpeg streamclip or quicktime to de-interlace or make your SD material into progressive, this is what I used to do with my HDV material and I made 1920x1080i 25p pro res files for dubbing.

http://www.squared5.com/
Thanks for your advice, I'll see if t's better.
My HD test was not progressive but interlaced and everything was fine .
I switched from Canopus to Blackmagic to avoid those time wasting video compressions (and because of the video out firewire bug in 8.0.3 crashing sessions on opening).
This is not a hardware issue, the card is capable of playing SD 50i videos from Final Cut Pro smoothly using the same configuration.
The card should output the interlaced video, the projector does the deinterlacing job.
I guess it's a PAL only bug from Pro-Tools.
I'll try to reproduce the jerkyness in FCP tomorrow to find out the misconfiguration.
I'm pretty sure I'll find that the card is set to NTSC 60i in Pro-Tools when playing PAL 50i, which would explain bad scaling (aliasing) and field/motion issues.
I guess we'll (I'm sure we're not only 2 users working in PAL with a Blackmagic) have to wait for an hypothetic update...
Digi, sorry, AVID, please...
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  #10  
Old 04-20-2010, 02:59 AM
Gary Nattrass Gary Nattrass is offline
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Default Re: BlackMagic video Out : HD fine but SD jerky

If the HD 50i was Ok is it not the field order that is causing the problem as HD is upper field and SD is lower? You could ask the editor to set it to None and see if that cures the problem.
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