Guitar pedals - best way to interface?

[KaiXXX]

Hi,

I'm wondering what's the best way to interface guitar pedals (like delays, wahwah, distortion,... - from Boss, Line6,...) with the studio setup.

Since guitar pedals usually have instrument type unbalanced jack connectors and instrument levels, what is the best way to connect these to the adda converters?

As far as I understand, there are three major points to consider:
1. Level
2. Balancing/Unbalancing and type of connectors
3. Impedance

Soldering some adaptor-cables shouldn't be a problem, also the unbalancing could be done by soldering the "-" to ground.
Some adda-converters even work with unbalancend rca connectors with -10dB levels.

Output levels from the daw could be controlled from within the daw.

If you connect the pedal output to a DI-box and this to a mic pre, you have a level control. This would be correct interfacing, but it's pretty complex. A bit easier is using the instrument in on a preamp.

What about the impedance? Do I have to expect problems when I just connect a pedal to the ins and outs of the adda-converter? Like a dull sound, low-level, static noise?

I still think some pedals have a sound you can't get with any plugin, also playing a wah-wah with the mouse is just not same

Thanks

[Howardk]

My standard setup for electric guitar is:

Guitar to DI (Radial JDI) to preamp to 192 i/o input
Link from DI to Pedals to preamp to 192 i/o input
Pedal output to DI-2 (Radial JDI)
Link from DI-2 to Tube amps (Usually 2 or 3)
Mics on cabinets into ProTools.

Later if we want to change anything, I have it all so I can take the Pedal DI and Reamp, or the DI right from the guitar to Reamp. Radial also makes several reamp boxes to go from line level to isolated high impedance. . . check out Radial Engineering . The one I use is ProRMP re-amplifier

[PTUser NYC]

You have a pretty good understanding of the situation, and you have considered well each aspect except impedance.

It is true that the balanced / unbalanced issue is not really important here, and levels can be compensated for in the DAW (not to mention losing 6 db unbalancing the cable by leaving the cold lead hanging) but the sound will not be right unless you also address the impedance issue.

Also, "instrument level" can be lower than -10.

You've also correctly identified the right way to come OUT of the pedals and back into the line level world: through a D.I. and into a mic preamp. When you say that the instrument input on a preamp is easier, you're right it is, but you're wrong to think of this as different from a D.I. - its still a D.I. exactly the same, just built in.

The main link you're missing is from +4 low impedance output to instrument level high impedance input. That is best acheived by using a device like the ReAmp. Its kinda like a backwards D.I. - its takes a +4 balanced low impedance signal, and convertes it into an instrument level high impedance unbalanced signal.

http://reamp.com/

Go out of your DAW into the ReAmp. From the ReAmp into your pedals. From the last pedal into a D.I.. From the D.I. into a preamp. From the Preamp into your DAW.

This is also an excellent device for ReAmping guitars into an amplifier.

In that case, when recording the guitar:

From the guitar into a D.I.. From the D.I. instrument out into an amplifier so you can hear it and get the feel right. From the "mic out" of the D.I. into a neutral sounding preamp. From the preamp into your DAW.

Then after recording, from the DAW into the ReAmp. From the ReAmp into the amplifier, which can now be tweaked to get a perfect tone, or in the case of an apartment building, cranked up to full volume for one quick pass. Then mic the amp as usual.

Another way is to go if you have a TDM (low latency) system is from the guitar into the D.I.. From the D.I. into a neutral preamp. From the preamp into the DAW. From the DAW into the ReAmp, from the ReAmp into the amp - mic the amp as usual.

This last way is cool because you can comp the take and hear the result through the amp as you go - this is how I usually do it, and then I crank it up after I've tracked it to quickly record the amp nice and loud without annoying the neighbors as much as it would have had I had the amp blasting during the time it took to track the part.

Its also great to tweak the tone to match the performance for that last 10% of perfection.

Also, when you record a clean guitar through a D.I. into a preamp for later ReAmp-ing its important not to get too much color from the preamp. Like drums, a clean guitar often has a really quick loud part of its sound (the transient) that is here and gone before a VU meter can move quickly enough to show it. Make sure not to record the guitar too hot, or it will thicken out the sound going into the amp. In fact, observing 0dbVU (which can be as low as -18 or -20 dbFS on your digital meters) is almost always the right way to go - but that's another post.

I hope this helped!

[Mark Wheaton]

and when coming out of a DI into a preamp it should be into the mic input, since the instrument input would not need the DI, it is a DI as stated. the DI output I believe is to mic levels not -10 line levels.

[PTUser NYC]

and when coming out of a DI into a preamp it should be into the mic input, since the instrument input would not need the DI, it is a DI as stated. the DI output I believe is to mic levels not -10 line levels.

This is true. I'm sorry if I wasn't clearer, so if there is any confusion, this is absolutely right.

I wrote:

"From the "mic out" of the D.I. into a neutral sounding preamp."

Assuming that the "mic out" would naturally go into the "mic in".

And when I wrote:

"through a D.I. and into a mic preamp. When you say that the instrument input on a preamp is easier, you're right it is, but you're wrong to think of this as different from a D.I. - its still a D.I. exactly the same, just built in."

I meant to imply that if using the built in D.I. was 'easier' that it was in place of a D.I. as the original poster had written too.

Obviously I wasn't completely clear, so to avoid any confusion its good that you clarified.