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  #1  
Old 10-30-2022, 05:30 PM
kol12 kol12 is offline
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Default Music + SFX clipping

I have a music track that is quite bass heavy and my SFX are causing clipping in some areas. What is the best approach to remove the clipping without affecting the clarity of the SFX or music?
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  #2  
Old 10-30-2022, 09:01 PM
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nednednerb nednednerb is offline
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Default Re: Music + SFX clipping

Turn the volume down in the digital file, maybe at master level, maybe at track level.

Mix at 24 or 32 bit depth and a small volume change will stop digital clipping, but you probably want a larger change. Give yourself headroom. Spotify and YouTube go to -14 LUFS or whatever. Audio Engineering Society suggested audio for internet consumption (most audio) would be better mixed and mastered between -20 and -16 LUFS.

If you're clipping in the "auditory" domain (or rather, the sound is distorting and gross but not digital clipping,) probably definitely turn the volume down in the track. Bass heavy? Turn the bass down. Probably the very deepest and inaudible bass, and watch for transients.

Turning it up so high gives ZERO more clarity at 24 and 32 bit files. Turn it up when mastering. Headroom gives more clarity than "Clarity Booster Pro 17"


If the problem is not "sound" related and just clipping technically, simply use a transparent limiter, don't saturate further, but headroom is a really good idea too I would suggest.
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>> me: nednednerB //
||main gig: editing audio voiceovers & testing software | 2nd gig: music software tutoring | hobby: electronic music //
||software: Sonoma 14.2 | PT Studio 2023.12 | Ableton Live 11 | iZotope RX, Ozone, Neutron | Arturia Pigments | Auto-Tune | Dubler2 //
||system: iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2020) 10-Core-i9 | 128GB-DDR4 | 5700-XT-16GB | OWC Thunderbolt Hub and Thunderbolt 3 Dock //
||devices: RME Babyface Pro FS | Focusrite Clarett 2Pre | some AT mics | SM58 | Ableton Push 2 | Sennheiser HD 600 HP // Onkyo TX-8220 SR
||automation: SoundFlow | Stream Deck+ | Keyboard Maestro | SteerMouse | MacOS Shortcuts //
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  #3  
Old 10-30-2022, 11:11 PM
kol12 kol12 is offline
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Default Re: Music + SFX clipping

Thanks @nednednerb for the tips. Is mixing bit depth different to the session bit depth?

Adding to the original question - what does it mean when an EQ is clipping (IN and OUT) but not the master fader?
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Old 10-31-2022, 01:14 PM
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nednednerb nednednerb is offline
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Default Re: Music + SFX clipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by kol12 View Post
Thanks @nednednerb for the tips. Is mixing bit depth different to the session bit depth?

Adding to the original question - what does it mean when an EQ is clipping (IN and OUT) but not the master fader?
Bit depth is basically "the number of discrete volume levels possible" for each Sample which plays at a rate of 44.1 kHz or 48 kHz and so on. Sample Rate is kind of "twice the value of the highest audible frequency heard in the file".

You've seen waveforms, they have a top and bottom. The height is volume or "bit depth", and the number of ups and downs you can capture relate directly to Sample Rate. One sine wave cycle at 20 kHz (about the top of hearing range) has a top and bottom, so one second of 20 kHz wave has about 20,000 portions of wave above the fold and 20,000 portions below the fold. That's why you need a sample rate at least about 2x as fast to accurately represent the transition from "positive" to "negative".

Now, to get to your specific question.... I believe the Pro Tools internal mixer (communicating to CPU etc) is 64-bit. That means bit depth calculations are happening more often on the scale of two times the 32 bit of your audio file depth or two and two thirds times 24 bit. When you go to 16 bit, there are fewer steps.

This basically means your files at 48 kHz+ and 24 bit+ are SO detailed mathematically, that turning the volume down won't hurt the "perceived quality" of the sound. It's very very easy and good quality to turn up an amplifier and speaker and "mastered file" but very hard to take out distortion later. So what I mean by "headroom" is that the audio waveform will look spaced out. An ex-partner years and years ago described the audio waveforms I described as "over-compressed" that they were "sound sausages", zoomed out totally flat and no dynamic.

Listening to a mastered mix on Spotify is a bad reference to a mixer at home, because the mixer of those mastered tracks probably did not turn it up that loud at their stage in the process. Then the mastering engineer also probably did not turn it up louder than Spotify or YouTube Music does in their master. Therefore, listening to "well mixed but unmastered" audio would be more useful than comparing to mastered references on varied platforms. They might be harder to find for referencing though, so "knowing what will happen" and going with some sorts of measured standards among your hearing based choices will help.
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>> me: nednednerB //
||main gig: editing audio voiceovers & testing software | 2nd gig: music software tutoring | hobby: electronic music //
||software: Sonoma 14.2 | PT Studio 2023.12 | Ableton Live 11 | iZotope RX, Ozone, Neutron | Arturia Pigments | Auto-Tune | Dubler2 //
||system: iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2020) 10-Core-i9 | 128GB-DDR4 | 5700-XT-16GB | OWC Thunderbolt Hub and Thunderbolt 3 Dock //
||devices: RME Babyface Pro FS | Focusrite Clarett 2Pre | some AT mics | SM58 | Ableton Push 2 | Sennheiser HD 600 HP // Onkyo TX-8220 SR
||automation: SoundFlow | Stream Deck+ | Keyboard Maestro | SteerMouse | MacOS Shortcuts //
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  #5  
Old 10-31-2022, 01:15 PM
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nednednerb nednednerb is offline
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Default Re: Music + SFX clipping

(I was blocked from posting the whole message and tried splitting it up):

For example. most theatre is mastered around -24 or -23 LUFS, but Spotify is -14 LUFS. Therefore, you don't want to mix a song to -14 that will be used in a movie soundtrack, unless you want to sound like crap. Unfortunately, that means a lot of what's out there is too loud AND too quiet in different parts of same file/stream/project.

Regarding your question about EQ clipping (IN and OUT).... If the IN is clipping, that means the plug-in immediately before the EQ (or the clip gain maybe if the EQ is first insert) is clipping. So turn down the one before, and sometimes plug-ins have an "input" knob you COULD turn down, but I'd probably go earlier. That said, regarding my story about 32 and 64 bit mixing, such clipping MIGHT NOT make bad sound. The internal mixer of PT can "digitally redline" without the sample (waveform) being square-shape truncated and held for a time at full "0 dBFS".

If the IN is not clipping red, but the OUT is, that means the processing inside the plug-in is what's causing the plug-in or mixer to go into the red. If the EQ clips red, then the mixer volume for the track or another plug-in like a compressor/limiter reduces the level, a master fader might well be in the green. Tracing through plug-in chains might show as you point out an EQ that is red IN and red OUT.... My advice is reduce the level going into the EQ and see what else needs to adjust around that change if the mix does something you didn't want (something too quiet now, because you lowered the EQ, etc).

Something else to consider, an old plug-in might be coded at a lower bit depth such that its calculations WILL sound distorted even though the Pro Tools mixer can theoretically sound clear on the output and be red. Analog mixers usually have a tolerance to higher levels to some extent, and one really does have to measure to keep things right. Your waveform could be higher and your listening monitors turned down and you could make the reverse judgment call as needed if the waveform was quiet and the monitors were turned up.
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>> me: nednednerB //
||main gig: editing audio voiceovers & testing software | 2nd gig: music software tutoring | hobby: electronic music //
||software: Sonoma 14.2 | PT Studio 2023.12 | Ableton Live 11 | iZotope RX, Ozone, Neutron | Arturia Pigments | Auto-Tune | Dubler2 //
||system: iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2020) 10-Core-i9 | 128GB-DDR4 | 5700-XT-16GB | OWC Thunderbolt Hub and Thunderbolt 3 Dock //
||devices: RME Babyface Pro FS | Focusrite Clarett 2Pre | some AT mics | SM58 | Ableton Push 2 | Sennheiser HD 600 HP // Onkyo TX-8220 SR
||automation: SoundFlow | Stream Deck+ | Keyboard Maestro | SteerMouse | MacOS Shortcuts //
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  #6  
Old 11-01-2022, 04:26 PM
kol12 kol12 is offline
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Default Re: Music + SFX clipping

Thanks for the informative posts @nednednerb, will certainly take it on board.
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  #7  
Old 11-03-2022, 12:28 AM
kol12 kol12 is offline
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Default Re: Music + SFX clipping

@nednednerb

If you're interested this is what I've been working on, a sound redesign of Apples Mission Implausible M1 Chip iPad:

https://www.mediafire.com/file/45ozm...Apple.mov/file
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