Please help test - Pro Tools 2023.9 reproducible MiniGrand GUI crash on Sonoma 14.1

[Darryl Ramm]

I started to get time and work though some of the crashing I'm seeing with Pro Tools 2023.9 on Sonoma. I saw this on 14.0 and now 14.1.

One problem I found is an easily reproducible crash in MiniGrand. And I'm hoping others can try this to see if it's also a problem for them. I'm on a 2018 15: MacBook Pro (so Intel) but would be great to see if others see this on Intel or Apple silicon systems running Sonoma. I'm running the latest MiniGrand 1.2.11.7db087e from AIR_Instrument_Bundle_23.8.0_Mac.dmg)

1. Create a new empty session
2. Create a mono VI track
3. Insert MiniGrand on that track
4. In the MiniGrand UI click on the "STRETCHED" tuning scale button
5. In the MiniGrand UI click on the "EQUAL" tuning scale button
6. In the MiniGrand UI in the bottom border click on the wrench icon
7. If the expected popup Window appears click the X to close it.

At Step 6 or 7 Pro Tools will crash. It does this 100% reproducibility for me.

I am not sure if there is a quicker way to do this but the you seem to need to click the STRETCHED button then EQUAL.

The Pro Tools windows will just silently dissapear and you should see a Crash Report dialog. The crash reports may vary a little from crash to crash but will typically show Pro Tools crashed because a thread doing GUI image display for MiniGrand called an abort().

I've got support case 04705800 open for this just to give Avid a heads up.

[Darryl Ramm]

It would be great if anybody else can try out MiniGrand on Sonoma and see if this happens for them.

I upgraded my Sonoma 14.1 system to 14.1.1 and not it seems this problem is harder to reproduce. It takes a bit more messing around in the Mini Grand UI but I can still get it to crash (or hang). See this video as an example: https://youtu.be/qAc3OQkiO8k

All the hangs show stack traces related to UI/image memory handling.

Sometimes it hangs instead of crashing, but those hangs show similar stack traces.

I'm down this rat hole because I was seeing general crash/hang instability on Sonoma. It might be this is specific to only MiniGrand, I'm trying to reproduce other crashes/hangs. I hope this is not just a MiniGrand bug, I've have not been able to reproduce these issues with MiniGrand on Ventura, but will try some more.

I'm also seeing occasional glitches with the MiniGrand EQUAL button not responding to mouse clicks at times in a way similar to what was seen in the BF76 plugin recently with buttons not responding (bug PT-299618). So maybe all this is related...

[JFreak]

No crash here. M1 Mini fully loaded. Maybe it is an Intel thing?

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by JFreak

No crash here. M1 Mini fully loaded. Maybe it is an Intel thing?

Thanks! Could well be Intel only. I don't have the Apple Silicon MBP to test on anymore. And sometimes this takes a while to reproduce so I appreciate if you have any more spare time to just bang around on the MiniGrand UI, and this is on the latest 23.8 AIR VI bundle release, I've not tested earlier ones.

[Dale-c]

I have both Intel and M1 but Sonoma had so many issues for me I reverted to Ventura. My son, playing around with PT Intro on his iMac with Sonoma hasn't been getting any errors but I could try to reproduce it

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by Dale-c

I have both Intel and M1 but Sonoma had so many issues for me I reverted to Ventura. My son, playing around with PT Intro on his iMac with Sonoma hasn't been getting any errors but I could try to reproduce it

What issues? And did you do an in-situ macOS upgrade or a clean upgrade?

2023.9 on Sonoma 14.0 on my Intel MBP seemed OK in the first early test but was really very unstable with crashes and hangs, it was a clean install of Sonoma. Updating to Sonoma 14.1 and removing most third party plugins helped a lot, but I have not finished the work there to see if there was really other plugin issues. And along the way found this seemingly neat bug with MiniGrand. But it might be Intel only and might even not be Sonoma specific, just maybe shows up there more sometimes.

Did you keep the Sonoma boot volume? It's always a good idea if you can try basic troubleshooting out when there is a problem. If you son can try out MiniGrand and just playing with it's UI like in that video I posted it would be great.

[_JJ_]

Yes, same crash here. Those GUI inputs instantly close ProTools. I also tried "wrench" first, "STRETCH", "wrench" again, "EQUAL" (reluctant to switch back), then "wrench" and that simply locked up PT with the spinning color wheel. That's a weird one!

[Darryl Ramm]

Thanks JJ!

I suspect the SWOD/hang is just another flavor of crash, it's all happening in memory handing to do with UI graphics in the MiniGrand plugin. (I've looked at the stack traces when I get the SWOD/hang and the crash).

Good to have that reconfirmed. Whether this is an Intel only thing or not, or even MiniGrand only or not is still TBD, but it's something that needs to get fixed and Avid folks include Marianna are helping make sure this is visible.

I was seeing gross instability on Sonoma, upgrading to 14.1 (and then 14.1.1) seemed to improve things, and avoiding MiniGrand and this bug also helped (I just happened to be using MiniGrand in a test session). But I still need more soak time with larger session on Sonoma to feel happy.

[jlthla]

so FYI
I have a MacStudio, with the M1 Max chip. I'm on PT 2023.9.

Not sure I'm following your instructions exactly, as this step Create a mono VI track has me confused, as I don't see that option in the New Track dialog. But I created a mono Instrument track, followed you instructions, and it worked fine. The VI didn't stall, and PT did not quit.

I'm not a power PT MIDI guy by any means, so could be my Instrument track is not what you have as your VI track.

[_JJ_]

Thanks for running the test. This must be an Intel thing then - which is good news of a sort. The PT team is working to sort it out for those of us on older Macs. VI meaning Virtual Instrument so yeah I think what Darryl meant is an "Instrument" track since that's the option we all see.