Volume automation in AAFs from Media Composer used in Pro Tools problem

[mskmadison]

(Re-submitting this post. Not sure if the first one submitted successfully)...

I work at a TV station. We produce long form music and doc style programs. Our workflow involves video cut together by videographers on a workstation with Media Composer. The rough cut is then handed off to audio specialists who may incorporate post-multitrack mix downs of concerts and will also do cleaning and sweetening to the audio in the video cuts.

We have been using the AAF export from MC to Pro Tools to transfer the projects back and forth.

We've run into a problem with this work flow. The problem is that when a video editor uses the volume automation tools in a MC sequence--for example to cross-fade music tracks or dip-audio under when there is a voice over or something--those volume automation instructions are improperly translated by Pro Tools. We've found that PT is using a different resolution and curve when there is a fade down or up over time.

The problem was identified because we handed back a bounced stereo mix to a video editor and they said it was different than their original rough cut and the cross fades and audio dips were wrong.

To test the theory, we ran 400 Hz tone into MC at 16 bit 48 kHz at -20dBfs. In the MC sequence, I added a volume "rubber band" or automation envelope to attenuate the output of the track in steps at 5 second intervals. (I've attached a picture for a visual representation) The steps down were snapped to the "decibel lines" on the audio tracks in MC.

I exported a mix-down of the audio from MC using the project settings (16/48, stereo, *.wav) and brought both the rendered audio and an exported AAF with the project media into a PT project using matching settings (16/48).

We then bounced the audio from the AAF imported into the PT timeline and compared to bounced audio from MC to the bounced file from PT.

We confirmed that when the volume is attenuating down, Pro Tools is using a faster fade curve than MC is and is creating different results.

To further test this, I brought the same AAF into a different DAW (Nuendo) and did the same thing (exported a rendered file from Nuendo).

What surprised me is that Nuendo interpreted the MC volume rides correctly (or at least the same as MC did). Pro Tools was different. Nuendo was not.

This problem will potentially make us stop using Pro Tools for sound editing of MC projects and move to a different DAW. It doesn't seem like we're asking the software to do something obscure or out of the ordinary. It's voice-overs with audio dips and cross fades.

We're using the latest update of Pro Tools 11 (not HD) on a Mac Pro tower (6-Core Intel Xeon, OS X 10.9.5). We ran the same test on a different install of Pro Tools on a Mac Book Pro and had the same results.

The Media Composer software is version 7 installed on AVID blessed computers.

Anyone have any ideas if we're doing something wrong or if there is a bug/problem with the software here?

Many thanks.

[Chief Technician]

Originally Posted by mskmadison

We're using the latest update of Pro Tools 11 (not HD) on a Mac Pro tower (6-Core Intel Xeon, OS X 10.9.5). We ran the same test on a different install of Pro Tools on a Mac Book Pro and had the same results.

The Media Composer software is version 7 installed on AVID blessed computers.

Pro Tools v11.3.1 and which version of Media Composer? v7.0.4.3?

[mskmadison]

Thanks for the reply and the question. For Media Composer: The file version is 7.0.4.3730. Product version is 7.0.4.

[mskmadison]

Bump.

[marianna]

Mark

Can you send this to me via email so I can get case created and have support check it and escalate if necessary. still running behind on email after NAB which is why I am asking you to send the deets direct.

Thanks and I will send back a case #
Marianna

[Farmer Dave]

FWIW this is biting us now as well, with PT 12.4

AVID and PT play back the volume graphs with a different algorithm. My guess is that PT is playing it back logarithmic, and AVID linear.

My manual fix was to delete AVID's volume graph fade, and replace it with a PT linear fade "file". Then the gain matches on the fades.

One terribly tedious step that should not be happening!

[marianna]

Dave
Absolutely agree. I asked Tope to check this thread and create a case and get support on this one. I noticed you didnt provide your specifications so when someone from support reaches out, please do so.
Thanks Dave for posting this and allowing us to jump on it "finally".
Marianna

[DigiTechSupt]

@Farmer Dave,

A support case has been created. Case 03499407. Please take note of this as your reference.

[Idiophonic]

Hello,

I am currently working on a film project that is experiencing this exact issue, with music editors using ProTools Ultimate v2021.12, and picture editors using MC v2018.12.7. The volume autmation in AAFs created by MC does not playback correctly in ProTools 2021.12. (Has this been addressed in later versions of Media Composer possibly?)

This is a maddening issue to be experiencing, especially when I came to find out that it has been known about for nearly 4 years!

Any help from an AVID rep on how to get volume automation in an AAF from MC to playback correctly in Pro Tools would be greatly appreciated!

System info:

MacBook Pro 15.1
Mojave 10.14.6
Intel Core i7 - 2.2 GHz, 6 cores
32 GB RAM

Pro Tools 2021.12
AVID HD Native Thunderbolt + HD Omni Interface


Thanks,


Tim

[marianna]

Hello Tim.....

The audio team would be the best to assist you but I do have the Co-install chart

https://avid.secure.force.com/pkb/ar...ser-Co-Install

PT 21.12 & MC 21.12 are tested and compatible and do not exhibit this behavior.

I did check the cases for the 2 people who reported this and unfortunately, neither one of them sent in their MCFax or responded back to the techs with details.

If you want me to check versions I can but MC 2018.x is EOS and we aren't upgrading and updating that anymore nor are we 2019.x

Marianna