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#1
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Native system over TDM WOW!
Hey all,
With the power of CPU's growing to where they are now, I decided to do a little informal DSP power comparison between the MixPlus systems we have at work and my 001 system at home. I basically instantiated as many Bombfactory 1176 plugins as I could on a 24 bit 44.1K session with audio on every track. On the MixPlus system (1 Mix Core, 1 Mix Farm) I was able to get 27 instances of the 1176 during playback before I ran out of DSP. On my Athlon 2000+ XP native system I was able to get 110 instances (no that's not a typo) before I ran out of DSP. That's right, 22 tracks with 5 1176's on each track playing back audio. I'm sure the new G5's are just as impressive. As someone who was considering getting a TDM system for home, it seems to me the only reasons these days to spend all that money on a hardware DSP system is for more tracks, expandable inputs and outputs, and latency advantages. However, with the $4-8K price difference, I think I'd rather spend the money on Rosetta 800 and Big Ben as my front end, and maybe move up to a 002R for 96K. Thoughts? |
#2
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Re: Native system over TDM WOW!
Were you using RTAS and TDM plug-ins on the TDM system... and how fast a computer is the TDM rig? You should be able to have the best of both worlds with a TDM rig.
Rail
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Platinum Samples www.platinumsamples.com Engineered Drums for BFD |
#3
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Re: Native system over TDM WOW!
Hi Rail,
No, I was only using TDM plugs on the MixPlus. I just wanted to pit only the DSP hardware cards against the CPU in the native system. Of course with a newer Mac, using both TDM and RTAS plugs will beat all. But I'm getting hard pressed to find enough reason personally to justify paying several thousand dollars for hardware cards whose DSP power is trumped by a $70 CPU. I'm starting to get the feeling that hardware based cards can't stay ahead of the game to compete with the rate of CPU advances, which is why I'm now having pause about stepping up to the HD systems for the kind of money it requires, when my native system is already so powerful. |
#4
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Re: Native system over TDM WOW!
I do a ton of work on my 002 (editing).. but for tracking a live band, or serious work.. I definately prefer to use a TDM Mix or HD rig. Some of the newer EQ plug-ins (GML and Sony) definately make it worth the extra cash. I've often recorded vocals to an 001 or 002 using outboard converters, so I believe there's definately a place for both systems. Digi have also announced input switching/PEC style recording for their TDM systems.. and their new Accel cards which up the DSP and support more extreme plug-ins - so the TDM system will continue to stay ahead of the LE system.
Bottom line, if you don't need what an HD rig offers, you'll definately be able to do a lot of work with an 002 and a fast processor. Rail
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Platinum Samples www.platinumsamples.com Engineered Drums for BFD |
#5
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Re: Native system over TDM WOW!
Quote:
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Quad 2.5 G5, 4.5G RAM |
#6
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Re: Native system over TDM WOW!
Hi! Agreed Rail
When it comes time for doing more complex mixes, using many voices and plugs, I wouldn't use anything else. Yeah, it is finally getting practical to use native only. Combined with HD Aceel tho... 190 voice limit, and using the cards to do all the EQs, dynamics, 'verbs, and basic mod's & delays...well, leaves that precious native power open for softsynths, special FX, and any other little power-suckers one wants. At a price tho... (last torture test with an HD3 non-Accel yielded 128 voices, 128 Ren EQ's, 128 Ren Comps, 2 ReverbOne's, Enigma, 6-tap delay, and a few other specials, all TDM, no native used, stable. Sorta like my "Davec for TDM" test)
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nikki k Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines. On the other hand, you have different fingers. |
#7
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Re: Native system over TDM WOW!
mmm..
Well keep in mind the TDM (Mix series) is pretty old by now.. I've got my P4 2.4Ghz sessions on HD system and was happy that I can push native v.s. TDM power of HD1 worth plugins (without RTAS). Still you should try comparing system with age let's say a 3.2Ghz CPU v.s. HD|Accel. I havn't checked such system yet though from few talks with people from Waves they've told me they're killers in power and makes it again worth going DSP rather than native... TDM also gives better track count and most important Auto Voicing while LE is 32 tracks limited. pretty limiting mix down situation though 6.x enables doing complex mixing with pre-mixes it's far less attractive than TDM. However you're right! on my studio I have 002R based system and for our budget it's the best thing. I believe it's wiser to buy LE rig with good convertors, pres & super computer than TDM when budget is important but when I go to studios that have the budget you always good TDM and... Mac (again budget ).
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Just wanna do music, RA. |
#8
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Re: Native system over TDM WOW!
As someone who was considering getting a TDM system for home, it seems to me the only reasons these days to spend all that money on a hardware DSP system is for more tracks, expandable inputs and outputs, and latency advantages. However, with the $4-8K price difference, I think I'd rather spend the money on Rosetta 800 and Big Ben as my front end, and maybe move up to a 002R for 96K. Thoughts?
[/QUOTE] I really thought the TDM systems were more expensive because the Sound itself has a much better quality than an Mbox or 002rack. But if it is only because it has more tracks , hell with it. What you saying makes sence. |
#9
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Re: Native system over TDM WOW!
What about this!!!
Protools HD 1 $7,995 192 I/O Interface $3,995 Midi I/O Interface $595 Sync I/O Interface $2,095 Pre Preamp Interface $2,495 Waves Platinum Plug-in Bundle $3,800 (Diamond $7000) $20,975 list Digi 002R Interface $1,295(via optical I/O's) Midi I/O Interface $595 Pre Preamp Interface $2,495(standalone mode) Apogee Rosetta 800 Interface $2,995 Apogee Big Ben Interface $1,495 Waves Platinum Plug-in Bundle $2,100 (Diamond $4200) $10,975 list Record a 32 track/24-48k session using the VERY same outboard gear (mics, drummachines, guitars, etc.), Mix down with the same plug-ins and Compare?
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Docta'J Download free music at http://www.nukmusic.com nEVER uNDERESTIMATE kNOWLEDGE |
#10
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Re: Native system over TDM WOW!
And now with the VST adapter we can use the UAD-1 and Powercore on le finally. I actually have two 002rs synced together with Athlon computers that give me 32+21 on the davec. Still a heck of alot cheaper than HD.
Shan
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Pro Tools Power User Editing Give your plug-ins a facelift...and skin 'em! __________________ "Music should be performed by the musician, not by the engineer." Michael Wagener 25th July 2005, 02:59 PM __________________ Pro Tools|HD Native 9.0.1 | Pro Tools|HDX 10.2 | Studio One | REAPER 4.22 | HD OMNI | HoboMac Pro 2.26Ghz Quad-Core | W7 Ultimate 64-bit |
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