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  #1  
Old 05-16-2021, 06:45 PM
basehead617 basehead617 is offline
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Default Hybrid engine effect on S6

I noticed this bit of info in the HDX Hybrid Engine page:

The Hybrid Engine enables you to run bigger sessions more smoothly because it can use native and DSP voices at the same time. It also eliminates round-tripping when using native and DSP plugins on the same track. This has the added benefit of reducing system delay, which directly improves the fader and knob responsiveness of a control surface.

Can Jeff or Eddie weigh in more specifically on that? Is this talking about improving control surface performance only on tracks with both native and aax dsp or in general?
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Old 05-16-2021, 06:52 PM
basehead617 basehead617 is offline
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Default Re: Hybrid engine effect on S6

And an extra question on the responsiveness front - is there any plan to have a motherboard revision of the master module with 10 GbE support? It's supported right out of the box on newer Mac Pros and would be a benefit I'm sure.
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Old 05-17-2021, 02:38 AM
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Farhoof Farhoof is offline
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Default Re: Hybrid engine effect on S6

It has to do with fader lag and delay compensation.

When there is a lot of delay in your session, the tracks are played back early in order to arrive in time at the output. This is how the delay compensation engine works. When you mix you are responding to what you are hearing, which is the track plus all de delay afterwards, so your fader movement will be written a bit later on the track because the playhead has already passed that part because of the delay compensation. It is impossible for the track to take this into account because it cannot see into the future to see what you will do. Also it would be wrong for Protools to take this delay into account when writing the automation, because then it will sound different from what you just did.

The best solution is to have the least amount of delay after your mix faders. When using dsp and native mixed together, known as round-tripping, you are adding extra delay (native>dsp>native will add twice your H/W Buffer Size). The hybrid engine claims to eliminate roundtripping, thus shortening the delay, thus making the faders more responsive.
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Old 05-17-2021, 04:33 PM
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Default Re: Hybrid engine effect on S6

Very well said!
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Old 05-18-2021, 03:39 PM
lucienpalmer lucienpalmer is offline
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Default Re: Hybrid engine effect on S6

Quote:
Originally Posted by basehead617 View Post
And an extra question on the responsiveness front - is there any plan to have a motherboard revision of the master module with 10 GbE support? It's supported right out of the box on newer Mac Pros and would be a benefit I'm sure.

I would be surprised if it could benefit from 10 Gb. An S6 should not be coming close to maxing out the capabilities of 1Gb. Maybe a tiny bit faster for session load, if anything.
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Old 05-18-2021, 09:08 PM
basehead617 basehead617 is offline
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Default Re: Hybrid engine effect on S6

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Originally Posted by lucienpalmer View Post
I would be surprised if it could benefit from 10 Gb. An S6 should not be coming close to maxing out the capabilities of 1Gb. Maybe a tiny bit faster for session load, if anything.
It's not about bandwidth, in my understanding the serialization delay of 10 gbe switches is roughly 1/10th of 1gb switches, so it should improve responsiveness.
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Old 05-19-2021, 10:28 PM
LukeHoward LukeHoward is offline
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Default Re: Hybrid engine effect on S6

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Originally Posted by basehead617 View Post
It's not about bandwidth, in my understanding the serialization delay of 10 gbe switches is roughly 1/10th of 1gb switches, so it should improve responsiveness.
Switch latency is in the order of microseconds though so, probably the distance between your faders and speakers makes more of a difference.
“Normally, for the most commonly used Gigabit Ethernet switch, the switch latency ranges from 50 to 125 microseconds. And for another popular switch, 10GbE switch, the switch latency usually ranges from 5 to 50 microseconds”
http://www.fiberopticshare.com/netwo...-switches.html
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Old 06-08-2021, 10:53 AM
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Default Re: Hybrid engine effect on S6

The Master Module and the Ethernet speed are not the bottle neck. Its the data coming and going from Pro Tools. Whilst PT is playing audio, rendering automation, Plugins and updating its graphics, it is also sending and receiving out EUCON commands. One of the things we are currently working on is better multi threading of the automation and EUCON data. There are some S6 surface drawing improvements in 21.6 coming shortly but a lot more is being worked on for later this year, this will be mostly in PT and speed up how it sends and receives data to and from the S6.
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Old 06-08-2021, 03:50 PM
basehead617 basehead617 is offline
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Default Re: Hybrid engine effect on S6

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Originally Posted by EddieJones View Post
The Master Module and the Ethernet speed are not the bottle neck. Its the data coming and going from Pro Tools. Whilst PT is playing audio, rendering automation, Plugins and updating its graphics, it is also sending and receiving out EUCON commands. One of the things we are currently working on is better multi threading of the automation and EUCON data. There are some S6 surface drawing improvements in 21.6 coming shortly but a lot more is being worked on for later this year, this will be mostly in PT and speed up how it sends and receives data to and from the S6.
That's awesome Eddie..
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