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  #11  
Old 06-19-2021, 03:09 PM
BScout BScout is offline
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Default Re: Older TDM style "voice stealing" workflow an advantage?

The comp/edit-select track sits on the visible playlist (top level -- empty at first), everything else is in playlist view below where it is recorded into. All sections are copied "up" to the comp track from the playlists (comp track designated as the target track.) The playlists below are left unchanged since it is a copy.
"Overwriting" isn't an issue because it's just a copy. As I go, I copy sections up (highlight, shortcut keys -- which I have assigned to a mouse button)

When I'm done, I just collapse playlist view and the finished track is ready to go (with alternates below if needed later.) And HDX set to autofade eliminates any pops in the edits on the comp track until I want to manually put fades in at the end.
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  #12  
Old 06-20-2021, 02:48 AM
kosmokrator kosmokrator is offline
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Default Re: Older TDM style "voice stealing" workflow an advantage?

I can see this workflow work very well for fast-paced Voice Over recording sessions.
So I'm on board, let's bring manual voice allocation back.
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  #13  
Old 06-20-2021, 05:09 AM
Mark Ziebarth Mark Ziebarth is offline
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Default Re: Older TDM style "voice stealing" workflow an advantage?

Hey Steve,
the very good arguments you have for the voice stealing workflow gets even more attractive if you take into account there are folder tracks in actual Pro Tools! Instead of all the cluttered tracks in the Edit Window you can dive into a folder to do your comping. You can hide the mess like with playlists but have all the advanced opportunities of voice stealing. Seems like a perfect combination.

Best

Mark

PS: Nice to hear you take good care of my beloved TDM plugs.
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  #14  
Old 06-20-2021, 05:50 AM
Cheesehead Cheesehead is offline
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Default Re: Older TDM style "voice stealing" workflow an advantage?

We used to use this method on TDM for 'versioning' promos when I worked
in TV promotions.
Basically the same as your video workflow. It was a very fast and easy way of working.
Even with the massive number of voices apparently about to drop for Ultimate, I can still see it's usefulness.
It would be great for ADR for instance.

Thumbs up from me for bringing it back.
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  #15  
Old 06-20-2021, 10:04 AM
Bushpig Bushpig is offline
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Default Re: Older TDM style "voice stealing" workflow an advantage?

Hi All,

Thanks to everyone for the continued feedback.


Kosmokrator:

>>>> I can see this workflow work very well for fast-paced Voice Over recording sessions. <<<<

Precisely. When I ponder about workflows in Post Production, I often think of Voice Over work. Voice stealing just seems like a no brainer to me in the high pressure context you guys operate in. My Jenga Tower and Frozen Tetris turned sideways analogy may sound like a organisational nightmare to some (from my imperfect description), but it is THE most flexible way to keep alternative lyrics (re:dialogue) laid out in situ and freely accessible at all times.


Mark Z:

>>>> Instead of all the cluttered tracks in the Edit Window ........... have all the advanced opportunities of voice stealing. Seems like a perfect combination. <<<<

Excellent point. Folders are yet another thing I'm looking forward to (hopefully) one day taking advantage of. And their use would make Voice Stealing even better. Great call.


Cheesehead:

I agree with everything you said! I certainly applaud Kyle and the engineering team's colossal efforts to bring the Hybrid Engine and increased overall voice count to ProTools (definitely all very much welcomed of course), but as I'm sure I've well overstated by now, it's the fluid and elegant workflow streamlining that can be achieved with Voice Stealing that's just so fantastic!! Versioning is another good use case I'd wondered about previously, but as I don't actually work in Post, it's great to hear that peeps like yourself can see the same advantages there that I benefit from working in humble old music recording.


Being primarily a music guy, I also assign the same stereo voice to the collection of "guide tracks" I usually collect up in my sessions for a given project (a batch of tracks of relevant commercially released songs for reference etc). With the same stereo voice assigned to all these tracks, only one can play at a time (which is kind of an obvious requirement for listening to a ref really), and which has the added bonus of never putting me in danger of accidently un-muting more than one playback track at a time and doing damage to my speakers or ears. As we all know, this sort of finger slip does happen pretty often.


Again, thanks all. I'm slightly overwhelmed with the support you guys are all showing for my wee "crusade" here. I've resisted the urge to try and get this ball rolling for the longest time, feeling I was whistling in the wind, but it's thanks to Kyle Splittgerber's much appreciated willingness to engage in discussions around PT improvements (inspired by watching what he and the team have achieved with the Hybrid Engine), that I felt the time was right to take another run at it again.


Cheers.


Steve
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  #16  
Old 06-20-2021, 02:18 PM
Bushpig Bushpig is offline
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Default Re: Older TDM style "voice stealing" workflow an advantage?

Hey BScout,


Sorry, forgot to include you in my last reply.


>>>> The comp/edit-select track sits on the visible playlist (top level -- empty at first) <<<<

Got it. And when you're recording the takes, are you doing drop-ins and taking advantage of "send overlap clips to playlist when recording" or whatever it's properly called? And/or do you prepare plenty of empty playlists to select on the fly??


>>>> "Overwriting" isn't an issue because it's just a copy <<<<

Yes, right, but what I find most frustrating, is say my master comp is (for example) a possible 8 words or half lines (or guitar chords etc) from 10 different takes. I start off with TK1 on the master comp, but now I have 10 options for word 2 across each of the 10 takes, 10 options for word 3 across each of the 10 takes, 10 options for word 4 across each of the 10 takes and so on, and so on. I can't just do a fully vertical slice across all 10 takes that separates out all 8 words, and then just mix and match them using simple region mutes like I can using voice stealing.

With playlists I have to bump each piece up to the top playlist or target master playlist, and then either copy it with another name to try a different combination, or undo and lose that particular selection as an instantly available option, and if I'm not sure which combination of words I want and I need to copy and rename all these playlists for safety, it very quickly becomes rather unwieldy. I know there's the key command to cycle through playlist pieces at the same position within the master playlist, but this is not as elegant and visually informative as having all the pieces I need on screen and always available, to mix and match in any combination I want at any moment.

Everything else you mention is awesome and obviously a great way to tidy up later, agreed.


Definitely interested in keeping this conversation going to find out in detail how others work. We don't spend as much time hanging out in each other's studio rooms these days like we used to. I miss that kind of trading of ideas.


Thanks again for the feedback.


Steve
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  #17  
Old 07-20-2021, 01:41 AM
Bushpig Bushpig is offline
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Default Re: Older TDM style "voice stealing" workflow an advantage?

Hi All,


I finally managed to find a minute to record a follow on video, to illustrate a few of my workflow methods as discussed in the main body of the thread here.


Apologies for the shocking quality. I don't have any dedicated video software, so I've hacked this together in a hurry with my minimal skills.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nhhaXYqhhBI


All comments welcome.


Steve
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