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Old 03-08-2007, 12:26 PM
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Default Digi... are these problems on the PC side too???

Just checking in to see if Danny or Digi can chime in on this dilemma. My studio is looking at moving at least partially to PCs in the HD realm (right now we have a Mac dual 2.0 Ghz G5 HD3 Accell). I know the 7.x bugs will eventually clear up in Macville.

But right now I'd rather pony up for a PC if 7.3 is more stable in the PC realm. I've checked out the PC DUC, but there really isn't an outcry of bugs. Either that's because (there's far fewer users in the PC pro market.... OR the PC pro market can actually get work done in 7.3 without regions moving, dissappearing etc).

Digi (or other studios using both)... Are the regions bug (as reported on a number of threads) and graphic freezes a common occurence on PCs??? Or do they seem to be Mac oriented?
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Old 03-08-2007, 12:29 PM
Rail Jon Rogut Rail Jon Rogut is offline
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Default Re: Digi... are these problems on the PC side too???

Most of the bugs you see reported - Bars/Beats, GUI Freezes, ... are Mac specific.

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Old 03-08-2007, 12:46 PM
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Default Re: Digi... are these problems on the PC side too?

Rail
what about the regions bug (where regions get lost, dissapear, copying one region to another track results in playing back of a different region, etc etc)... the one that has a thread THIIIIIIISSSSSSS long currently. Thats the one that's bitten me a few times. Is that Mac specific???


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Old 03-08-2007, 01:15 PM
Rail Jon Rogut Rail Jon Rogut is offline
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Default Re: Digi... are these problems on the PC side too?

I only had that happen with 7.3.1 on my Mac -- I never saw it on my XP system.. but I haven't seen it again on my Mac since installing 7.3.1cs1

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Old 03-08-2007, 05:16 PM
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Default Re: Digi... are these problems on the PC side too?

"what about the regions bug (where regions get lost, dissapear, copying one region to another track results in playing back of a different region"

I had this happen on 7.3.1 cs1 last night. I dropped a small vocal region from one track to another on top of al larger region, it removed the large region completely. Undo saved me. I had to move the larger region out of the way, and then I was able to place the region on the track. I also had a problem when recording audio, it removed a region that I recorded on top of, even thought the record entry point was a couple bars past the start point of the existing region. I also continue to have problems with Ivory (latest version) and my CPU is barely being used. . . and I have tweaked the Processor settings many ways. A 2.5 GHz G5 has done nothing for me over the G4 dual 1.42 I just replaced.
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Old 03-09-2007, 07:10 AM
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Default Re: Digi... are these problems on the PC side too?

This goes to the heart of my problem. I've been a soapbox Mac user since 1993. Me and my family smirked when my brother bought a PC to do office work at home ("he's joining the Dark Side" my Dad would say).

I understand it was MY choice to upgrade to 7.x. But the only reason I did THAT was because my system was unstable and I wanted to make sure I had the most updated version of everything so that support would be available and current.

I know there are folks out there with G5s and HD3 Accel doing work with little problems. Not so here. And my customers are starting to get fed up with goofy glitches, watching me reinstall plugins because the computer forgot they were authorized, etc. Things work right at 9pm only to be a mess at 9am the following day. And the Mac DUC is littered with folks who make more in one hour than I do in a week who are having serious issues too. And mostly Digi is saying "we cannot reproduce that here".

I don't see it on the PC side. And I DO NOT WANT to buy a PC. But I cannot afford a new Mac/exchange my cards (nor would I want to, judging by the issues people seem to be having). I just want to work for a living doing engineering, not IT support. And it seems like the roles have reversed. Now, Mac users in PT land are the ones who spend their days fighting their systems. And PC users are actually getting work done.

If that's naive, I hope someone sets me straight. Maybe there's a ton of probs on the PC side no one bothers freaking about. I'd love to think my Mac and PT would play nice soon in the next few weeks. I love Macs. I just need a faithful tool right now. And my Mac isn't it. And I cannot justify spending $7000 on a new Mac/new cards in the hopes that I have basically the same functionality I had yesterday...sans crashes. (Sounds like Waves WUP). A new souped up PC from Sweetwater would run me around $3200, and I could use my cards. Still not a bargain, but if I have to pay it to get work done, so be it.

I'm just trying to figure out whether or not my logic is flawed. I am crazy booked till into the summer (not gloating here, just making a point). I'm a few demos mixes behind because I have spent SO much time trying to keep things stable. I already lost 2 weeks over Christmas because of this... and thought I had it licked. Guess not.

Anyway, sorry for the rambling. If anyone has any insight, I sincerely thank you.


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Old 03-09-2007, 08:24 AM
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Default Re: Digi... are these problems on the PC side too?

Hello. This has been my experience for the last 3 to 4 years with Pro Tools. It performs much more stable on the PC side than on the Mac side. However I think that the system itself performs much more stable regardless of the application. One thing I know is that a couple of years ago the LE version just outperformed the Mac version but I think that was a function again of the CPU's on the PC side outperforming the Mac stuff. Nowadays with the Intel chip on both sides thing have sort of leveled out.

As far as stability in both LE and TDM my experience is that Pro Tools is much more stable on the PC. Admittedly I have not worked on a Windows XP TDM system in about 3 years or so but it was always very stable. The LE system I have used since then has been extremely stable. Never crashes and I don't see any of the graphic freezes, etc. This is why it's my opinion that these general random graphic glitches are more due to OS issues and not Pro Tools issues.

No platform is perfect. There can be an equal amount of problems on the PC side as on the Mac on specific individual cases. It's been my experience and that of the people I know however that once you get your Windows XP configured correctly it is rock solid. For some people the mere thought of working on Windows XP makes them want to kill themselves so they would rather put up with the occasional bug. If you are not very well versed working on the Windows side of things and are seriously considering going that way, you may be better off having someone consult you on it. And I definitely don't mean getting a computer from Sweetwater. I mean someone you know, a friend or a colleague or a friend of a colleague, who can give you some direction. You can build an incredibly powerful and rock solid system with better specs more cheaply than going through Sweetwater.

Check the Windows LE forums for threads on the Best Desktops , Best Laptops and Best Quad core desktops for Pro Tools. It's full of step by step instructions on how to build a system that has been proven time and again by dozens if not hundreds of people to be affordable, super strong, fast and stable. Incidentally those Quad's have been shown to have the power of an HD1 or HD2 system just natively.

After saying all that I think your best option is to get one of the current Intel Mac computers, buy Parallels or download Boot Camp, install Windows XP and then run Pro Tools on the Windows XP side for a while. If it works better for you then there is your answer. If it doesn't then you can still go back to the Mac side. Good luck either way.
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Old 03-09-2007, 10:20 AM
Rail Jon Rogut Rail Jon Rogut is offline
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Default Re: Digi... are these problems on the PC side too?

You cannot run Pro Tools HD inside Parallels (I did try). Pro Tools HD runs perfectly under Boot Camp but the Mac Pro can currently only see 2 gigs of RAM in Boot Camp (Leopard should apparently fix that).

I've maintained for years that Pro Tools is much more stable under XP... once inside Pro Tools it really shouldn't matter which OS you're running. OS X has been a moving target for developers, so it's understandable IMO.

That said, I am now seeing very few of the bugs reported on my Mac Pro with 7.3.1cs2 in OS X.

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  #9  
Old 03-09-2007, 12:00 PM
froyo froyo is offline
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Default Re: Digi... are these problems on the PC side too?

Hello. I am right there with you Rail about Pro Tools being much more stable under XP. My own experience working on both platforms for the last few years has shown me this also. However I tend to think Windows XP is just a more stable OS regardless of what application you are running. I wonder if you feel this way also or if you think just Pro Tools is better.

A little disappointing about Parallels. I am considering buying an Intel Mac, probably a laptop, and running Windows XP under Parallels. I suppose I can do it with Boot Camp but I like the idea of running it through Parallels and that way I don't have to reboot every time I want to go to Mac or PC.

I also agree with you that once you are running the application, whichever software it is, the experience is pretty much the same. About the biggest difference is remembering the shortcuts (CTRL replaces Apple, etc). I think most people will find that as much as they may personally dislike Windows XP, as you said, once you run Pro Tools the rest won't matter.
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Old 03-09-2007, 12:19 PM
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Default Re: Digi... are these problems on the PC side too?

At this point then, I will probably start looking at PC options. I know Sweetwater sells them all ready for PT. From what I gather from reading this and other forums, those PCs may not be the best and they may actually be more expensive.

I need a rock solid config. One built for HD3 and 20 hrs a day, 6 days a week usage. Unless someones got a great suggestion, its off to scan the PC forum for me.

Need I mention that I just perfected a mix (or so I thought). Had it crash, and somehow my automation is gone, even from backups. rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
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