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  #1  
Old 05-27-2021, 11:32 AM
undadogz undadogz is offline
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Location: United Kingdom
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Default Patchy Help

Hello all I am looking for some advice regarding Protools and patch bays here is a general idea of my setup

Protools hdx
Avid 16x16
2 x8 channel mic pre amps
ssl sigma
8 various compressors
4 guitar amps (jmp1 style )
and various other outboard gear
16 inputs from live room via snake 4 of those are trs
12 inputs from Vocal booth via snake 4 of those again trs
3x bantam patch bays 2 are signed db25, other is unknown but is a mix of xlr and trs leads
c24 controller

my main question is regarding workflow and the pre amps both of the pre amps have adat connections should I connect the snakes from live /vocal direct to the back of the preamps then to the avid 16x16 via adat or , would it be better to plug it all into the patch bay ?

my other question would be patch bay order would it go like this if everything was going to the patch bays

top row. mics in from live/vocal
row 2. mic pre amp inputs
row 3. Avid 16x16 inputs
row 4 ssl sigma inputs
so the signal would run on a Normalled patch bay without needing to patch,
then a similar thing with the outputs of each connected device example row 2 channel 1-16 mic pre inputs 17-32 mic pre outputs and so on
and just one more thing I have a Audient monitor controller do I run all I/o to the patchy for that to :)

Any help would be great many thanks
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  #2  
Old 05-27-2021, 01:36 PM
albee1952 albee1952 is offline
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Default Re: Patchy Help

There are several ways to do this and you might consider whether you really NEED patchbays. Having said that, and assuming you have Patchbays that are TT with 48 points per row, this is what I would do:
1-Top row would have all inputs from wall panels(optionally normalled to...)
2-2nd row would be all preamp inputs
3-3rd row would be all preamp outputs(normalled to.....
4-4th row would be all interface line-level inputs
The only reason for another bay is if you have outboard gear that needs to be available for patching(and I would not go thru a patchbay for outputs unless you have some special need). Also(again, my opinion), unless you have some really special outboard hardware, I would not use it for mixing. Keeping your mix ITB(In The Box) makes for perfect recall and there are so many great plugins, using hardware is just not needed(IOW, its not likely to make better music or a better mix). In my own commercial studio in Nashville, I spent a lot of time/money/effort on patchbays but in truth, I really did not need them anywhere near as much as I thought I did when I spent the money(and this was with 32 outboard preamps, 8 hardware inserts and 8 hardware EQ's and compressors)
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  #3  
Old 05-27-2021, 10:01 PM
undadogz undadogz is offline
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Default Re: Patchy Help

Hi many thanks for your advice I totally get what you are saying and have run my small studio without patch bays for many yrs ,and using plugins, I now want to record live drums, and some live bands , generally experimenting with sound and mics, and would like a permanent setup
.
may I ask about where the Ssl sigma would sit in the rack ,
as say from left to right,
Patchbay 1
Top row. mics from the live/vocal channels 1-28
Row 2 Pre amps channels 1-16 (could use c24 pre for 17-28
Patchbay 2
Top Row. mic pre outs 1-16
Row 2 Avid inputs. 1-16,
Patchbay 3 ?would it be as follows
Top Row Avid outputs 1-32
Row 2 ssl inputs 1-32 ...
would I need to bring 32 channels from ssl back to protools or just the stereo main outputs to say Patchbay 3 row 2 channel 17+18 ?

Many thanks
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  #4  
Old 05-28-2021, 07:46 AM
albee1952 albee1952 is offline
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Default Re: Patchy Help

I would skip Patchbay #3 entirely(at least for now). You have no need of having tons of outputs. Just run your main outputs to your monitors(thru the monitor section of the C24) and headphone outputs can go directly to your headphone amps. The only reason to have outputs on a patchbay would be for mixing thru an analog console or a summing box. All this is new to you so your best route is to keep things simple until you get to a point where you actually need it to be more complex.

I'm not clear on what the purpose of the 2 SIGMA units is in this setup as your IO will all be handled via Digilink thru the HDX card(or do the SIGMA's have Digilink connections?
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  #5  
Old 05-28-2021, 11:52 AM
undadogz undadogz is offline
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Default Re: Patchy Help

Hi thank you for your reply , the ssl sigma is a 32 channel summing mixer and is all Db25 connections, it has Alt L/R Mon L/R Mix bus L/Ron xlr outputs the Db25 outputs are suppose to go back to the daw so you get the ssl analogue desk its a lovely sounding unit
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  #6  
Old 05-28-2021, 05:46 PM
albee1952 albee1952 is offline
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Default Re: Patchy Help

Ah, in that case, I would simply feed as many available outputs as you have directly to the SIGMA inputs and feed the L/R from the Sigma to the patchbay so you can patch in for mixing, but lose those 2 line inputs for tracking(and don't feed the SIGMA into mic inputs). Of course, if you want to hear the SIGMA all the time, then maybe add another HD IO(or a used 192 if budget is tight), or run the Alt outputs to the monitor section of the C24 so you can listen(or not). Or, maybe think about a nice monitor/source selector(Presonus Central Station, Audient Nero, Dangerous 2-Bus, etc)
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