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  #1  
Old 05-02-2008, 06:25 AM
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DonaldM DonaldM is offline
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Default MIDI to Instrument track record

I've assigned the output of a midi track to the input of an instrument with Hybrid instatiated in it. The Midi track plays Hybrid with no problem. However, when I try to record the part in the instrument track, nothing records, even though Hybrid is being played off the midi track.

Here's what I did: Recorded the midi track from external source, then assigned output of MIDI track to input of the Hybrid instrument track. Hit record in the instrument track, fired up record on the transport box and hit play. The 2 measure leadin click count was audible and then the midi track played Hybrid, but nothing actually recorded in the instrument track. When I play the exact same sequence from the external source directly to the instrument track, it records fine. So, why won't it do the same with the midi track? What difference does it make if an external source is triggering the midi events or the midi track is? I must be missing a step somewhere, but can't figure out what.

Thanks for any help.
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  #2  
Old 05-02-2008, 07:31 AM
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spkguitar spkguitar is offline
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Default Re: MIDI to Instrument track record

Quote:
I've assigned the output of a midi track to the input of an instrument with Hybrid instatiated in it. The Midi track plays Hybrid with no problem. However, when I try to record the part in the instrument track, nothing records, even though Hybrid is being played off the midi track.
What, exactly, are you expecting to happen here? Instrument tracks do not record audio, they record MIDI data. You are not using MIDI data as input for this track.
Quote:
Here's what I did: Recorded the midi track from external source, then assigned output of MIDI track to input of the Hybrid instrument track.
No. That's not what you did, and this is probably where part of your mis-understanding is coming from. You assigned the output of the MIDI track to the Hybrid instrument itself, NOT the Instrument track's input. Understand? Setting the MIDI output of a MIDI track to the MIDI input of an Instrument track is not at all possible.
Quote:
Hit record in the instrument track, fired up record on the transport box and hit play. The 2 measure leadin click count was audible and then the midi track played Hybrid, but nothing actually recorded in the instrument track.
Again, what exactly were you expecting to happen here? What is it you are trying to do? Are you trying to record the audio output of the plugin? If so, you need to be bussing the output of that instrument track to a record enabled AUDIO track.
Quote:
When I play the exact same sequence from the external source directly to the instrument track, it records fine. So, why won't it do the same with the midi track?
Because as I mentioned above, it is not possible to route the MIDI output of a MIDI track to the MIDI input of an instrument track. Why are you trying to do that in the first place? It is not necessary at all; the hybrid instrumnt is going to play the same either way. What benefit would there be? Why not just move the whole MIDI region from the MIDI track to the Instrument track.
Quote:
What difference does it make if an external source is triggering the midi events or the midi track is? I must be missing a step somewhere, but can't figure out what.
I think you are definitely confused about something. It's just hard to tell what it is.

Maybe this will clear things up a bit;
  • an instrument track is just a combination of a MIDI track and an AUX track. MIDI data can be played/recorded into it, and Audio can pass in and out of it.
  • Instrument tracks do not record audio; Audio only passes through an Instrument track, either from an external source (hardware synth) or an internal one (Virtual instrument plugin)
  • The record functionality on an Instrument track is exactly the same as it is on a MIDI track.
  • An instrument track has two different sets of I/O; one for MIDI data, and one for audio data.
  • Instrument tracks record MIDI data. If you already have a MIDI track with the MIDI data recorded, there is no reason to record it to an Instrument track.
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  #3  
Old 05-02-2008, 08:49 AM
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DonaldM DonaldM is offline
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Default Re: MIDI to Instrument track record

Quote:
Quote:
I've assigned the output of a midi track to the input of an instrument with Hybrid instatiated in it. The Midi track plays Hybrid with no problem. However, when I try to record the part in the instrument track, nothing records, even though Hybrid is being played off the midi track.
What, exactly, are you expecting to happen here? Instrument tracks do not record audio, they record MIDI data. You are not using MIDI data as input for this track.
Well, technically I am using MIDI data as input because the output of the MIDI track is nothing but MIDI data, in the same way thay recording a midi or instrument track off an external controller is midi input to those tracks.

Quote:
Here's what I did: Recorded the midi track from external source, then assigned output of MIDI track to input of the Hybrid instrument track.
No. That's not what you did, and this is probably where part of your mis-understanding is coming from. You assigned the output of the MIDI track to the Hybrid instrument itself, NOT the Instrument track's input. Understand? Setting the MIDI output of a MIDI track to the MIDI input of an Instrument track is not at all possible.
Quote:

Okay, that makes sense and I see your point.

Quote:
Again, what exactly were you expecting to happen here? What is it you are trying to do? Are you trying to record the audio output of the plugin? If so, you need to be bussing the output of that instrument track to a record enabled AUDIO track.
No. What I thought would happen is that the midi data of the midi track would be recorded over to the instrument track. I know that if I want to record the audio output of Hybrid I need to route that output to an audio track.

Quote:
When I play the exact same sequence from the external source directly to the instrument track, it records fine. So, why won't it do the same with the midi track?
Because as I mentioned above, it is not possible to route the MIDI output of a MIDI track to the MIDI input of an instrument track. Why are you trying to do that in the first place? It is not necessary at all; the hybrid instrumnt is going to play the same either way. What benefit would there be? Why not just move the whole MIDI region from the MIDI track to the Instrument track.

[/QUOTE]

I understand what you're saying, but it doesn't make sense that the midi output of a midi track can't be routed to the midi input of an instrument track. What else can it be but midi output from a midi track? If I route the output of a midi track to the input of an instrument track, it is midi input and nothing else that is playing the instrument. It's the same if my input source is an external controller directly to the intrument track. Midi data is midi data. Which is why I asked:
Quote:

What difference does it make if an external source is triggering the midi events or the midi track is? I must be missing a step somewhere, but can't figure out what.
Maybe this will clear things up a bit;
  • an instrument track is just a combination of a MIDI track and an AUX track. MIDI data can be played/recorded into it, and Audio can pass in and out of it.
  • Instrument tracks do not record audio; Audio only passes through an Instrument track, either from an external source (hardware synth) or an internal one (Virtual instrument plugin)
  • The record functionality on an Instrument track is exactly the same as it is on a MIDI track.
  • An instrument track has two different sets of I/O; one for MIDI data, and one for audio data.
  • Instrument tracks record MIDI data. If you already have a MIDI track with the MIDI data recorded, there is no reason to record it to an Instrument track.

[/QUOTE]

I do understand this part. What I'll need to try and do is recreate what I did, only go directly to the instrument tracks and see if it comes out the same way. However, I also wanted the midi track because I will be routing it to other external gear and back in as audio as well so the one plays off the other. In other words the exact same midi data plays Hybrid doing one thing and also triggers sounds from an external module doing something else, with its output routed back into PT via my mixer as audio to an audio track.
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  #4  
Old 05-02-2008, 09:07 AM
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spkguitar spkguitar is offline
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Default Re: MIDI to Instrument track record

Quote:
No. What I thought would happen is that the midi data of the midi track would be recorded over to the instrument track.
Why would you need/want to do that? You can just select the MIDI region/track and move/copy it to the Instrument track. There's no need to record it from track to track at all.
Quote:
I understand what you're saying, but it doesn't make sense that the midi output of a midi track can't be routed to the midi input of an instrument track.
Why not? See, I feel the total opposite; I think what you are trying to do doesn't make any sense. Again, why would you want/need to do this when you can just move/copy the whole of the MIDI data from track to track? See what I mean? Re-recording it just doesn't makes sense as copying the data is so much easier/faster.
Quote:
What else can it be but midi output from a midi track? If I route the output of a midi track to the input of an instrument track, it is midi input and nothing else that is playing the instrument.
But the MIDI data is already recorded. There is no reason to re-record it from track to track. The instruments all have their own inputs, so it isn't necessary to route the MIDI output from one track to the other.
Quote:
I also wanted the midi track because I will be routing it to other external gear and back in as audio as well so the one plays off the other. In other words the exact same midi data plays Hybrid doing one thing and also triggers sounds from an external module doing something else, with its output routed back into PT via my mixer as audio to an audio track.
But you can do that with a single Instrument track. You can route the MIDI output to multiple ports/outputs. There is no reason to duplicate the track at all (unless you want/need to alter the data on the duplicate track in some way).
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  #5  
Old 05-02-2008, 10:15 AM
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DonaldM DonaldM is offline
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Default Re: MIDI to Instrument track record

I see your point and thank you for your explanation. My initial misconception was that the instrument track was also recording MIDI data in the same way (basically) that a midi track does.

That said, it still doesn't quite make sense that an instrument track in record mode and controlled from a separate MIDI track wouldn't record the data in the same way midi input from an external source would be recorded. But that's splitting technological hairs for something which, as you rightly point out, isn't really necessary to do.

Thanks for the insights.
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  #6  
Old 05-07-2008, 03:57 PM
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Default Re: MIDI to Instrument track record

"No. That's not what you did, "

I'm sorry, but this had me in stitches!!!!!
I see what you are trying to do, but spk is right that if you already have the performance, just move the MIDI data to the instrument track(s) and have it play those sounds, then record the audio. I did a similar thing in Reason from a second PC, where I laid out a sequence in Reason, and wanted to have the MIDI notes record into a Pro Tools MIDI track. This was mainly for my own curiousity, but also so that I didn't have to export a MIDI track from Reason (which probably would've been easier). All you need is the performance, which you obviously already have. You're basically like using PT/Hybrid, etc., as a sound module, and would then change sounds/instruments as needed.
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