woah! inaccurate grids?!

[jonny munka]

I cut my drum samples perfectly and then duplicated them across the song using the grid. Worked fine on three songs but on one of them the samples begin smack-on and then become 'out' with the grid later in the track.
I can't hear it - I can only see it when I zoom-in, but I'm getting a drummer to play along and it might affect him. I've tried re-doing them carefully from scratch but the same thing ends-up happening. What's going wrong?

[peter parker]

thats what ive been wondering for the longest time, and im even working with clean cut already made samples.

whenever i duplicate or repeat i notice it sounds good to the ear, but as it roles down the line it gets further from where its supposed to fall on the grid.

for beat loops i've sometimes had to manually set each individually duplicated region exactly on the "1" of each bar on the grid. otherwise if i didnt they would not be dead on. and ofcourse i have the right bpm....etc.....
i edit on the 0 .....theyre as perfect as you can get........and it still does not match to the grid as it goes down the line.

ive wondered about this. what do others do?

for beats its a pain, but you can still do what i described.....adjusting each region manually to fit the grid perfect.
but what about an electro bassline. you cant really move those duplicated regions manually to fit the grid perfect because then a noticable gap occours. with drums it works out smooth...

but yeah, what do others do? i dont think i can edit any better than what im already doing? so why does it never fall exactly onto the grid after duplicated or repeated???

[DEVIZE]

Originally posted by peter parker:
what do others do? i dont think i can edit any better than what im already doing? so why does it never fall exactly onto the grid after duplicated or repeated???

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Set your midi tempo to your sequence and apply it. The grid will change then you have to trim your regions very close to the begining of your region and at the end. Keep tarck of your bars if its an 8 bar it should end at the 9th bar. Your tempo should show on the top part of the edit window(the blue, pink or whatever part).

Select the region and repeat it and insert fades where they are needed.

I haven't run into any of the problems you fellas are discussing.

my 2.

[peter parker]

i dont mess with midi at all, and don't plan on starting. i do straight loops that i extract using toast, and import into the session, then i edit, and tweek my audio blocks from there. (i use pitch n time to adjust tempos when needed)

its odd that no matter how perfect you edit a loop it wouldnt just line up exactly with the grid "perfectly" when you duplicate or repeat it several times.....

zoom in super close and check.....maybe yours dont line up either.

[saeblee]

Make sure you have Bars:Beats selected as the active tool of measurement, and NOT the Minutes seconds. This selection is somewhere near the top right section of your screen. I had a very similar problem that was fixed easily by this remedy. It's worth a try.

[dkrz]

Using the duplicate command in grids view DOES NOT automatically drop a region in tempo or on the grids at all.

You can see this simply by cutting a 1 bar loop to start exactly on a grid line on bar 1 but then purposely cut it so that it falls about a 32 note short of the next measure. Select it and duplicate using command + D.
Right away you can see the problem… Grids and samples are different measurements and can't be (in PT at least) perfectly rounded off numerically. The grid is 'tic' accurate while an audio region is 'sample' accurate. No matter how you slice it (no pun intended), the two just don't add up. After a while it's gonna go out of time since the program does not adjust for the time discrepancy and the duplicate command does not quantize a region for you.

The best way, I think, to copy loops is, set your view to 1 bar grids. Cut your loop the way you want it. Then highlight it and use the option, click and drag method of duplication with the grabber tool. As you pull out the duplicate, you can clearly see that it does in fact NEED to fall exactly on the next grid line (it has nowhere else it can go). It has no choice but to land exactly on the next grid line. Next, select both regions and repeat the process. You now have four regions. Now, select all four and repeat, you've now got eight; etc. etc… Before you know it, you got lots and lots of repeats, all of which fall right were they are supposed to with no drift at all.

Hope that clears it up.

dk

[DEVIZE]

Originally posted by peter parker:
i dont mess with midi at all, and don't plan on starting. i do straight loops that i extract using toast, and import into the session, then i edit, and tweek my audio blocks from there. (i use pitch n time to adjust tempos when needed)

its odd that no matter how perfect you edit a loop it wouldnt just line up exactly with the grid "perfectly" when you duplicate or repeat it several times.....

zoom in super close and check.....maybe yours dont line up either.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Me either(midi)....it just takes to much CPU and I love my external hardware sequencer.

You have to set up you tempo in the midi window in order to change the grid to your sequence tempo.

No way mine are off...I'm doin it right and my regions are exactly how they come out of my external gear when I line them up a repeat them. I trim them nice and line them up right. Like I said haven't had this problem. OE on your part.

Then, I use the 002's control surface to mix my tracks down.

Just give it a try.

[AverageJoe]

Sounds like you have done what some of the other posters have said- selected just your loop for duplication, which might not end right on the grid.

If you select the WHOLE MEASURE (or 2 or 4 or whatever), and then duplicate, you'll be cool.

[AdamF]

I used to have this problem but now as part of my "routine", whenever I have a, lets say, 1 bar loop, i'll grid it up, then select that whole bar, (not the audio, but the whole grid bar) and consolidate that section. If you duplicate this, you should be able to go on forever without straying off.

[s2n]

If after duplicating the same loop, and then zooming in, you see a 1-2 sample width region between your loops, you've just encounted the sample-rounding bug in Pro Tools. This sample-rounding bug happens while in bar/beat mode. Simply duplicate the loop while in mins/sec mode.