Why Can't I Get Pro Tools To Sound Like A Record? Need Help Bad!

[BaRaq']

Ok, I have a pair of Behringer TRUTH powered monitors that I use to monitor projects that I recorded on My Pro Tools Mix Plus System and I can't (If My life depended on it) create a mix that sounds good. I only have the plug-ins that came with the system. I loaded in some 14 day plug-ins from Bomb Factory, TC Works, etc. to enhance the chances and I can say that the mixes was 60% better but I can't afford any plug-ins because We spent all We had on Pro Tools & The Mac w/Glyph Trip! Shouldn't the plug-ins that came with the Mix Plus be enough to record an album and do great mixes without having to spend another fortune on plug-ins?

[BaRaq']

I thought it would be helpful to list all the equipment in the studio so that all of you who post replies could find it easier to help me with this.

G4 450 w/512 MB RAM 30GB System drive
Pro Tools Mix Plus w/Pro Tools 5.1 software
888/24
1622
Glyph Trip (2) 9 GB 10k Cheetah Hard Drive & SONY DDS 4 Back Up Drive
MOTU MTP AV
Behringer EuroRack MX2004A Mixer
Behringer TRUTH Monitors
Avolon 737sp Mic Pre/Compressor
Nuemann 147 Tube Microphone
Alesis MasterLink 9600
EMU Mo Phatt
EMU SP 1200
Triton Pro X
Samson Headphone Amp (4) RadioShack Headphones

PC running XP Professional
512 MB 20GB System Drive 40GB Audio Drive
MIA 24/96 Sound Card
ACID 3.0f
Sound Forge 5.0f

[Peter Duemmler]

There are MANY MANY factors that influence the sound of a recording, ProTools and its plug-ins are only part of the game.
You CAN do worldclass work without plug-ins at all.
Work on your sources, mikes, positioning, preamps, _arrangement and playing_, ...

It´s a long way, don´t rely on plug-ins!

Peter

[Doug Ring]

Baraq', I don't mean to do a downer on you, but that's like saying, "I spent thousands on oils, brushes, canvasses, an easel and a studio, and my paintings still don't look like Rembrandt's."

You need patience, experience, and dare I say, talent. Then you can make good records with almost anything. I've been at this game over 20 years, and I've done very little that I would consider world-class. And I'm still learning.

[ejsongs]

the room itself makes a huge difference. I'd start there cause you can't mix it if you can't hear it.

Also, it seems that you are set up to do Hip/hop or R&B. well most of those records are recorded inPT but not mixed entirely in PT. You are trying to compete with ssl rooms with tons of outboard gear and records that have been mastered. That is kind of hard to do all in PT. Not impossible but hard.

ej

[peteri]

One tip that helped me out a lot recently - it came from a world class PT guy, and will probably start a huge war:

Watch your levels - I was keeping all my faders as high as I could, thinking as long as the master fader wasn't showing clipping all was well.

If the faders are at halfway - this is 24 bits, it is completely possible (maybe likely?) that if you have all your tracks way high you'll actually distort the mix bus (which is 48 bit) - this will result in poor stereo imaging and bass, and may/will not show up on the master fader.

So might be worth checking that - and trying to learn things like this, they make a huge difference.

Also use at least the 24 bit mixer, and maybe the dithered one - the 16 bit sucks and this was the default install that I got.

Funny thing is I have a Fender strat - and I don't sound like Hendrix! Remember having the gear is only about 0.1% of the battle!

Good luck

Pete

[audiaudio]

BaRaq',

Peter Duemmler and Doug Ring hit it on the head.

It's a journey--and having a PT system is only a very small step.

Hard-won knowledge and experience will take you where you want to go.

I've been engineering and producing professionally for years. I still find myself struggling to make my work sound like it was done by a real producer.

Your list shows that you have more than enough equipment to make really good sounding records. What you don't have (yet) is knowledge.

Analyze the work of the great ones, and compare side-by-side, with matched levels, your work to theirs. This process will make you very uncomfortable (you won't like what you hear), but it'll help you get better.

Good luck. Hope this helps.

[peteri]

To follow up on this - also watch everyone you can use PT - get every DVD/Video promo you can get (even the Digi001 is worth watching) - go to as many Digi events as you can.

Anything to pick up some tips - I've learnt so much from seeing PT demo'ed (mind you I'm just about to switch to Logic 5 as a front end - go figure!)

Pete

[beatboy]

I agree with all the above. It is a journey. It takes time. It takes time on a single mix. S**t in is S**t out. Good tools do help though.

[AE]

Hey, Keith, the fundamental question is:

Can you make fill in the blank with any arbitrary recording system/media sound like a record?

I'm can't tell if you're an experienced producer/engineer who is frustrated by the challenge of adapting to new technologies, or a beginning producer/engineer who is frustrated by just how difficult it is to do professional work even after investing in "pro" gear.

If it's the former, then there are a number of issues you have to get comfortable with before things will sound right (no potential for recording medium to enhance sound like analog tape, critical need to maintain acceptable operating levels, understanding of new, esoteric issues such as dither and sample rate conversion, etc.). Regarding specific Pro Tools issues, there is a very wide range of signal processing quality available; don't expect the stock plug-ins to sound as good as your favorite studio gear.

If it's the latter, then you just need to know that if you use your brain and your ears and work really hard for a number of years, you'll have a chance to be able to make recordings that sound like records. This new technology does a lot more for a lot less, but there's still (and I hope there will never be) no substitute for experience, knowledge, inspiration, creativity, passion, and all the other things that only YOU can bring to the mix...