Guitar clipping

[cpuck]

How do you reduce the amount of clipping when recording guitar? I usually play with heavy gain/distortion, and listened back with an acoustic plug in to my tracks, and noticed a wicked clip. Using an SSL 2+ interface. Interface meter and track meters never show clip/red, I am always well under orange/red. Any advice on how I can reduce clipping, and still maximize the signal from my guitar? thanks.

[Darryl Ramm]

Uh... well having some clue what you are doing might help.

What guitar are you recording? What pickups does it have? If tracking dry/DI are there any pedals in the signal chain before the DI? What ones in what order?

Are you recording dry/DI in or wet or what. If wet from a amp/cab then what amp/cab and what microphone and what preamp (if separate) from the interface. What gain in dB is the mic or DI preamp set to?

If playing back through an amp sim plugin, what one exactly and what are it's settings set to?

What is an "acoustic" plugin? You mean an acoustic guitar processing plugin? What exact plugin? What are it's settings?

Please don't talk meter "colors" they are often meaningless, and the break levels are changeable in the meters. You have a meter in front of you, showing you the level in dBFS, (start with classic meters) use the numbers. We cannot guess if you are looking at meters in pre or post fader mode, so be clear there. It should be pre-fader when tracking.

What are the pre-fader levels on the input track in dbFS? If you are adding processing and that is clipping the output DACs then you can turn down the gain in the processing steps, lower the input level to the plugin with clip gain, lower a track fader, reduce gain in a plugin, or add a trim plugin to the signal flow, etc. etc. paying attention to where is best to reduce that level in the signal flow for what you want. If the input is not clipped then Pro Tools internally will run well over 0dBFS without actual clipping, but you need to get back to below 0dBFS at the output. But hitting some plugins hot can make them sound horrible. And for good measure use 32 bit float files as well. You have meters all over the place to look at the levels (in dBFS).

The goal when tracking any signal should have almost nothing to do with "maximizing the signal". There is a huge dynamic range and many many dB of digital gain available to you in Pro Tools, in clip gain, fader gain, plugins, etc. getting any output you want should not be a problem. Keep tracking well away from clipping the signal on input (and there is nothing wrong with say tracking at say an average of around -18 dBFS for a wet guitar mic from a cab if it helps ensure there is no clipping on input).

One maybe not uncommon thing that can gets folks: If you are tracking a dry guitar signal then the signal will normally be very low, but pedals or active pickups can make that signal pretty hot. And if you crank too much gain on an amp sim then the wet signal may drive things hard enough to clip the output. Watching meters in the amp sim plugin if it has them may help.

[cpuck]

One maybe not uncommon thing that can gets folks: If you are tracking a dry guitar signal then the signal will normally be very low, but pedals or active pickups can make that signal pretty hot. And if you crank too much gain on an amp sim then the wet signal may drive things hard enough to clip the output. Watching meters in the amp sim plugin if it has them may help.

Thanks, that's amazing. I have a lot to go on from your answer.

It's a dry guitar, with active pickups, with no pedals, straight into the DI. The plug in is Polychrome DSP Mcrocklin on an Acoustic preset. This is my first active pickup guitar, and never had this problem in the past with passive pickups. I can start with the DI, clip gain and track fader, and start there. I will play around with it. Thanks for the great answer.

[massivekerry]

Originally Posted by cpuck

Thanks, that's amazing. I have a lot to go on from your answer.

It's a dry guitar, with active pickups, with no pedals, straight into the DI. The plug in is Polychrome DSP Mcrocklin on an Acoustic preset. This is my first active pickup guitar, and never had this problem in the past with passive pickups. I can start with the DI, clip gain and track fader, and start there. I will play around with it. Thanks for the great answer.

Yeah, active pickups can be REALLY hot going into an interface. Might also try dialing down the guitar's volume control a hair if it's still clipping after adjusting the interface's input level all the way down.

[cpuck]

Originally Posted by massivekerry

Yeah, active pickups can be REALLY hot going into an interface. Might also try dialing down the guitar's volume control a hair if it's still clipping after adjusting the interface's input level all the way down.

thanks, is it easier to record with passive pickups?

[massivekerry]

Originally Posted by cpuck

thanks, is it easier to record with passive pickups?

It depends on the interface. They all have different input gain structures. It kind of comes down to: experiment and see what works best for what you have. I have usually been able to get good sounds on my EMG-loaded guitar, but I have to turn the input gain all the way down on my interface (Carbon), compared to some of my passive-pickup guitars. I’ve even tried using a boost or overdrive pedal, but turning everything down on the pedal to lower the output level going into the interface. Tone-chasing takes time and experimentation.

[Darryl Ramm]

Originally Posted by cpuck

Thanks, that's amazing. I have a lot to go on from your answer.

It's a dry guitar, with active pickups, with no pedals, straight into the DI. The plug in is Polychrome DSP Mcrocklin on an Acoustic preset. This is my first active pickup guitar, and never had this problem in the past with passive pickups. I can start with the DI, clip gain and track fader, and start there. I will play around with it. Thanks for the great answer.

Are you talking an electric guitar with active magnetic pickups or active acoustic/piezo pickups? I was assuming electric, but seems unusual to run it though an acoustic amp sim, but hey whatever works for what you want.

Just take your time, try to look at the levels going into and out of amp sims and see how hot they are. If the amp sims don't have all the meters you want, you can stick a trim plugins before and after the amp sim plugins and look at the level on those (and use them to trim levels if needed). That may help you get a feel for levels.

thanks, is it easier to record with passive pickups?

Yes only a bit, because like you are finding out here it can be easier to drive amp sims too hot (esp. say if the active pickup is hot and you have a DI input/preamp with the gain turned up, etc.). But it's not a problem once you get used to gain staging stuff and managing the levels. You have to be watching the levels and think about what you change if the output is too hot. Like you might want to lower the input signal level to an amp sim with clip gain or you might want to lower the amp sim gain itself, or trim the output of it or do other things.

Many amp sims are very very impressive and realistic but you need to play with all these settings to kind of find your feet. The same as if you had assembled all the same physical equipment for the first time.

There are no rules, just watch what the levels are and be prepared to play around and listen to what sounds best (i.e. watch the levels to make sure they are not going to clip or drive way too hot but make decisions on what sounds best with your ears).

[cpuck]

Thanks so much for the help. Yes, they are Fishman high output Active pick ups. I will experiment from here, as I have always used passive pickups. Thanks for the great input.

[basslik]

Also make sure you are monitoring while tracking in pre, and not post.

[cpuck]

Originally Posted by basslik

Also make sure you are monitoring while tracking in pre, and not post.

Sorry, I am a total newb, what does that mean?