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  #1  
Old 08-02-2017, 01:19 PM
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DonaldM DonaldM is offline
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Default This may be a Win-10 Issue

I originally posted this in the MIDI forum, but I think its better here as I think this is a Win-10 issue. This isn't exactly a PT problem, though.

I don’t know if this is a Driver issue, a Win-10 issue or something else.

Earlier this summer I upgraded my system to Win-10 from Win-7. I’ve experienced all sorts of technical issues with my system since.

The latest is that my MIDI connection between my main MIDI controller which is the Motif XS8, and Pro Tools doesn’t work 80% of the time.

Here’s the details:
My Motif is connected to my PC via Firewire. I’ve used the Motif as my main MIDI keyboard for years this way, with Pro Tools, with virtually no issues. FW always works to play and record MIDI tracks and/or VIs.

When I upgraded to Win-10, I made sure I had the latest Yamaha-Steinberg FW driver for Win-10, which is 1.6.64 as far as I can tell.

Sometimes I have to reboot my PC 2-3 (yesterday it was 9...NINE) times before the MIDI is live. I test it by opening the Motif Editor in standalone. If I’m able to use the editor with the FW connection, then it usually works when I open a PT session. (But not always...another head scratcher!)

However, sometimes, I can’t even get the editor to recognize the Motif is there, and I have to reboot the PC...OR...worse, uninstall and reinstall the driver!

This is ridiculous. I have no idea even where to begin to resolve this. Can someone shed some light here for me?

Before anyone asks, yes, I’ve checked and rechecked the MIDI settings on the Motif and they are correct. And I’ve done the same in Pro Tools with the MIDI Studio settings there. That is NOT the problem. As far as I can tell, all my hardware is functioning properly.

I just don't know if its Win-10, the Yamaha-Steinberg Firewire driver, or something in Pro Tools that's causing the issue. I'm pretty sure whatever it is, it isn't hardware related. My main suspect is Win-10 itself. I suspect that something in the upgrade to 10 from 7 reconfigured something that somehow affects the performance of the FW driver or the FW connection itself. But what, I have NO idea.

At this point, I'm open to any/all suggestions. If I had some hint at what to look for, I'd do it...but I have no clue whatsoever as to what I might look for to solve this.

I can tell you that prior to upgrade to Win-10, under Win-7, my FW connection was NEVER an issue. It ALWAYS worked as it was supposed for MIDI and audio!

Any of you really clever, smart people out there have a thought or two? Thank you!
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  #2  
Old 08-02-2017, 02:38 PM
profdraper profdraper is offline
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Default Re: This may be a Win-10 Issue

Your could check for the latest Win drivers for the PC's firewire card via Windows Device Manager. i.e., not the Yamaha end of things, but the PC hardware side? Perhaps also check with the Yamaha /Motif people.

Otherwise, perhaps a clean install of Win 10 itself (seeing this was an upgrade over the top of a prior system). Bed that down with latest drivers, standard apps, networking, printing, whatever –*first. Then install the music s/w last.

Bit of a drag doing a clean install - depending on just how much stuff you have. On the other hand, usually cleans out the cobwebs and freshens everything up, removes old outdated etc. 'Could' be what this is.
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Old 08-02-2017, 02:45 PM
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mjslakeridge mjslakeridge is offline
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Default Re: This may be a Win-10 Issue

I would think a driver issue would cause it to not work at all, not sometimes. Check your midi cable and firewire cable. Could be a loose connection that is making intermittent contact.
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Old 08-02-2017, 02:53 PM
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Default Re: This may be a Win-10 Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonaldM View Post
My main suspect is Win-10 itself. I suspect that something in the upgrade to 10 from 7 reconfigured something that somehow affects the performance of the FW driver or the FW connection itself. But what, I have NO idea.

Hey Don, don't I remember you saying some time ago, that you didn't do a clean upgrade. You did a "in situ" upgrade?

Because if so, that's the quickest way to find out if there was a problem when that happened


It takes literally 30 min to reinstall and boot another fresh install of Win10.

Microsoft even preps the USB install key for you so you can keep it for another time.

Easiest thing ever,

1 reinstall Win10
2 reinstall mobo, graphics drivers
3 reinstall PT
4 reinstall midi, Yamaha whatever you have and test.
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  #5  
Old 08-02-2017, 02:56 PM
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Default Re: This may be a Win-10 Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjslakeridge View Post
I would think a driver issue would cause it to not work at all, not sometimes. Check your midi cable and firewire cable. Could be a loose connection that is making intermittent contact.
Yeah, I thought of that early on. But as far as I can tell, cable and connections are all good. I have two FW ports on the Motif, and the issue is the same regardless of which port I use. Same for the FW ports on the PC. Cable appears to be just fine, too.
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Old 08-02-2017, 02:57 PM
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Default Re: This may be a Win-10 Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by profdraper View Post
Your could check for the latest Win drivers for the PC's firewire card via Windows Device Manager. i.e., not the Yamaha end of things, but the PC hardware side? Perhaps also check with the Yamaha /Motif people.

Otherwise, perhaps a clean install of Win 10 itself (seeing this was an upgrade over the top of a prior system). Bed that down with latest drivers, standard apps, networking, printing, whatever –*first. Then install the music s/w last.

Bit of a drag doing a clean install - depending on just how much stuff you have. On the other hand, usually cleans out the cobwebs and freshens everything up, removes old outdated etc. 'Could' be what this is.
Checking the Win FW driver didn't occur to me. I guess I just assumed it was part of the win-10.
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  #7  
Old 08-02-2017, 02:58 PM
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Default Re: This may be a Win-10 Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by YYR123 View Post
Hey Don, don't I remember you saying some time ago, that you didn't do a clean upgrade. You did a "in situ" upgrade?

Because if so, that's the quickest way to find out if there was a problem when that happened


It takes literally 30 min to reinstall and boot another fresh install of Win10.

Microsoft even preps the USB install key for you so you can keep it for another time.

Easiest thing ever,

1 reinstall Win10
2 reinstall mobo, graphics drivers
3 reinstall PT
4 reinstall midi, Yamaha whatever you have and test.
It may come down to that. I was hoping I wouldn't have to, as I'd have to first back up a lot of other stuff. And there's a lot to reinstall after clean install, too.
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  #8  
Old 08-02-2017, 03:13 PM
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Default Re: This may be a Win-10 Issue

If you have a spare drive, do the clean install on that one. You don't have to reinstall all programs, just the ones needed to test the midi keyboard. Make sure all other drives in the computer are disconnected when installing Windows, this is important.

If that solves the issue, you have your answer.
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Old 08-02-2017, 03:40 PM
guitardom guitardom is offline
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Default Re: This may be a Win-10 Issue

Instead of uninstall-resintall drivers and such, have you checked the Device Manager when it is not working to see if the device is even present?? That would be the best place to check. Then instead of uninstall/reinstall, I would just disable-enable from there and see if that makes it kick back into being recognized. I would guess it is just driver issues. I have seen a couple other midi devices have these issues.
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  #10  
Old 08-03-2017, 07:48 AM
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DonaldM DonaldM is offline
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Default Re: This may be a Win-10 Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by guitardom View Post
Instead of uninstall-resintall drivers and such, have you checked the Device Manager when it is not working to see if the device is even present?? That would be the best place to check. Then instead of uninstall/reinstall, I would just disable-enable from there and see if that makes it kick back into being recognized. I would guess it is just driver issues. I have seen a couple other midi devices have these issues.
Yes, I checked there as well, and the Windows diagnostic says "This device is working normally". Yeah, right!
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