Eleven Rack---Live Use in Effects Loop?

[Chris Townsend]

Originally Posted by LVC

Soooooo
what is the answer can you or can't you use the ER in the same manner that you can use an Axe-FX or a GSP1101 - time effects (through loop of tube amp) Stomp box effects (through front of tube amp).

You can definitely do that with Eleven Rack. Here's one option:

Guitar -> 11R TrueZ Input
11R Output to Amp 1 (or 11R FX Send) -> Tube Amp Guitar In
Tube Amp FX Send -> 11R FX Return
11R Output to Amp 2 (or main outs) -> Tube Amp FX Return.

[frantick]

I stand corrected.

Thanks for clarifying that method of routing for us Chris.

I'm really enjoying the sounds and ease of use of the 11R!

-frantick

[TLTD]

I use a lot of tube preamps and find it's better to just put them into the eleven rack than try to use the 11R into them. Originally I was going to get some amp heads and a Palmer but I'm finding some good preamps out there for cheap and having lots of fun with it this way. The preamps I collected so far are Mesa Boogie Quad, Peavey Rockmaster, and Sansamp PSA-1. They compliment a lot of the presets well (sometimes you need to turn off the amp). You have the option of going direct and not hauling cabinets around although I still think they need to work on their cabinet selection/mic options a bit but it works pretty good.

But I imagine if you can get these effects into your loop you will be pretty happy. They really figured out how to make some big time sounds and they're adding more presets in a few weeks. Did you end up getting one? It's a dream signal router for everything and it only gets better from here.

[Stevie D]

Originally Posted by frantick

noob here. I'm looking for either an effects processor without distortion/amp sim, or one with those like the Eleven Rack. I've been looking in the $500 to $1000 range like the G-Major 2 (effects only). Not really interested in spending $2000 for an Axe-FX.

So, in just finding out about the Eleven Rack, my question is, should I decide that I ONLY want the delay, chorus, compressor, etc. effects from the Eleven Rack, because I like my existing wah, distortion pedal, and Carvin tone, how would I connect this 'in the loop' of my head/cab? I watched the videos and read the manual, but they just say to turn off cab/amp simulation and plug into the front of the amp. I would like to keep these types of effects, ie chorus, delay, compressor, etc. in the loop of the amp.

So, can I turn off the cab/amp/distortion, run my amp's send to the line in (Left or Right?) on the back of the Eleven Rack and the 'Output to Amp' (Right?) of the Eleven into the return of the amp? (My guitar amp has a 3-way +4,0,-10 switch in the effects loop.)

The reason I'm looking at the Eleven Rack is because it's 10 years newer than the aurally-unexciting 16-bit Pod Pro that I quit using years ago because it was too dull and compressed sounding, and I'm hoping the technology has evolved a lot since then. I don't really need an amp sim, but would welcome the extra amp tones if they prove roadworthy.

Thanks for all your expertise.

-fran

I posted this awhile ago. I was using only the effects for my acoustic guitars. I use the effects loop of my Taylor K4 preamp and only use chorus/delay/verb from 11R. May not be exactly what you are looking for, but it worked well for me.

Connections:
Acoustics into whirlwind 4 X 1 selector
Common of whirlwind to input on Taylor K4 pre
K4 fx loop send out to Line in 1 on 11R
11R Output to Amp 1 (front) to K4 fx loop return
This allows all four acoustics to be used by selecting via footswitch.
(note: The amount of effects seen at the K4 will be determined by the
11R Output to Amp 1 level.)

Acoustic Rig settings in 11R:
rig input to "Line L"
effects ahead of amp/cab
volume pedal after amp/cab
volume setting of amp/cab (amp input 1) to 0db (or desired amount of fx sent to K4)
**amp output setting to minimum (-24)
**volume pedal set to 0 and bypass
note: **this keeps the acoustic fx from feeding into the 11R Mains L and R (electric output to FOH)



best
Stevie D

[fly_with_v]

Oopa didn't get to the second page before I posted

[tonepursuit]

Originally Posted by Chris Townsend

You can definitely do that with Eleven Rack. Here's one option:

Guitar -> 11R TrueZ Input
11R Output to Amp 1 (or 11R FX Send) -> Tube Amp Guitar In
Tube Amp FX Send -> 11R FX Return
11R Output to Amp 2 (or main outs) -> Tube Amp FX Return.

OK, I tried this method. maybe I need to understand what output setting to use on each output under this set up, because, what I am trying to achieve is 11R stomp boxes in front of my own amps distortion and then the mod effects / delays / reverbs in my amps effects loop. In the setup above, I am still getting the modelled amps from 11R. I want to bypass the modelled amps alltogether. Just stomp boxes to my amps input and time / mod effects in my amps loop. Is that possible?

Alternatively, if I just need to forget about using the stomp boxes in the front of the amp, is it possible to just use the time / delay / mod effects in my amps effects loop just like a regular effects rack and still bypass all of the 11R pre-amp distortions and amp models. Bottom line is the amp models are not working for me in my set up and thought I could just use this and my ground pro as a rack effects unit. Thanks in advance for your help! Trying to line this up for rehearsal tomorrow....

[aaron.ferrer]

Originally Posted by tonepursuit

OK, I tried this method. maybe I need to understand what output setting to use on each output under this set up, because, what I am trying to achieve is 11R stomp boxes in front of my own amps distortion and then the mod effects / delays / reverbs in my amps effects loop. In the setup above, I am still getting the modelled amps from 11R. I want to bypass the modelled amps alltogether. Just stomp boxes to my amps input and time / mod effects in my amps loop. Is that possible?

Alternatively, if I just need to forget about using the stomp boxes in the front of the amp, is it possible to just use the time / delay / mod effects in my amps effects loop just like a regular effects rack and still bypass all of the 11R pre-amp distortions and amp models. Bottom line is the amp models are not working for me in my set up and thought I could just use this and my ground pro as a rack effects unit. Thanks in advance for your help! Trying to line this up for rehearsal tomorrow....

So turn off the amp and cab. edit>amp/cab>options>SW1 should be bypass.

I do this 4CM:

Guitar>11R input
11R FX send>amp input
Amp FX send >11R FX return
Amp output 1 or 2 >FX return.

This way your guitar goes into the 11R first, and processes everything before the FX loop and sends that into the preamp.

FX return on the 11R captures the stops going through the amp's preamp, and then the final output sends the whole thing (post fx loop effects) to the poweramp of the amp.

[tonepursuit]

Originally Posted by aaron.ferrer

So turn off the amp and cab. edit>amp/cab>options>SW1 should be bypass.

I do this 4CM:

Guitar>11R input
11R FX send>amp input
Amp FX send >11R FX return
Amp output 1 or 2 >FX return.

This way your guitar goes into the 11R first, and processes everything before the FX loop and sends that into the preamp.

FX return on the 11R captures the stops going through the amp's preamp, and then the final output sends the whole thing (post fx loop effects) to the poweramp of the amp.

Thanks for the quick help. where do I find the "edit>amp/cab>options>SW1 should be bypass." on the 11R, when I hold down the edit button, I dont have a amp/cab option. Just a amp/cab linking. where do I go?

Then what settings/selection do I use for the outputs on my 11R under outputs to amp? I am so new to all of this, I appreciate the help!

[moff]

If you want to send some FX to the input and others through the loop, you need to put the 11R's FX loop between the two...

I'm assuming you won't want to use the same O/D or delays all night, so you'll need to create multiple rigs with the different FX combinations you will use within them. Create them with amp, cab, and mic sims disabled. In each rig, place the FX you want going to the amp input (wahs, overdrives, distortions, etc) at the beginning of the 11R's virtual FX chain, followed by the 11R FX loop block, and then the FX you want in the tube amp's FX loop (the time-based FX). Make sure ALL FX are placed before the virtual amp/cab. Set the "Output to Amp" that you're going to use to "Amp Input" (this will effectively take the final "Output to Amp" signal from the end of the FX chain).

Then wire it like this:

Guitar>11R input (Tru-Z)
11R FX send>Tube amp input
Tube amp FX send>11R FX return
11R Output to Amp>Tube amp FX Return

In functional terms, what this accomplishes is:

Guitar > "front of amp" FX > amp input > amp FX send > "amp FX loop" FX > amp FX return. In short, it sends the FX that are before the 11R loop to the tube amp input, then takes the output of the tube amp's preamp back to the 11R to run the 11R's time-based FX, and finally returns those FX to the tube power amp.

However, this may be a moot exercise. YMMV, but while I love the 11R as a total solution, I find its onboard FX lacking compared to what's available in the market. They are certainly usable, but not something I'd spend $1000 on, especially when compared to FX other units that are better suited to this particular application, that have far more options and configurability, and at less cost. The M9/M13 units from Line6 comes to mind first. It is a popular choice, with lots of great sounding FX, and is True Bypass (I have one, and find it very useful in my "real rig, but it's not in my 11R rig). The TC Nova has some sweet time-based FX, but it must be used either in front of the amp or in the loop; you can't do the 4WM with it. The G-Major is a good in-the-loop solution, but doesn't have overdrives. I haven't tried a lot of the other multi-FX units out there, so can't comment.

Don't get me wrong, as a total solution, I don't think you can come close to the 11R. It's a great deal at the price, and sounds awesome as a whole, but it's forte is not its FX (hopefully in future...). There are others who do FX much better, and at this point, if I was looking for a unit to use in this particular application, I'd choose something else.

[tonepursuit]

Moss,

Thanks for the reply. However, when I move the amp/cab to the end of the chain, after ALL Effects, the fx loop is the next to the last thing right by the amp and it will not set me put effects between the loop and the amp. It forces me to have the loop at the very beginning or right before the amp in that scenario. weird.