Logic 9.1 just went 64 Bit!

[relaxo]

Yeah, but this is not fair, Logic can do so many important/vital things that PT can't and (vise versa), like midi note re-mapping, creating new midi tracks by splitting by note, or freezing, or going to that AMAZING area on the right in Logic to browse and audition sounds, etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc...these are INVALUABLE AND ESSENTIAL. Hell, Pro Tools doesn't even have an incoming/outgoing midi monitor window...also invaluable for troubleshooting midi connectivity and for programming samplers and drum machines. You have to be running Midi Monitor in parallel. Just in the environment window alone you can do 5000 more tasks than PT. It's a different way of working and you need to be technically minded to truly exploit the sheer power of Logic. Did I mention "etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc?" There are so just many important and valuable things that one program can do that the other can't.

I'll dare to say that Logic can do something like 2x-8x as many things as Pro Tools. You're right though, Logic is so half-assed compared to PT.

Originally Posted by 25ghosts

To all those contemplating this disturbed application, try this if you can.
I had the non-pleasure of working with it from 96 to 2005. As Apple got it, it just got worse.
Today I HAD to use it for old compato and while it may have 64 bits and new features no one needs
the overall stability of the application hasn't improved one bit. TGFPT


1) Solo Modes - Logic has one = SOLO

2) Select a group of track and re-order them = Logic cant you've gotta move track by track by track.

3) Select a group of tracks and try to duplicate them = Logic cant
(Unless you enter emagic's relic environment mode which has been completely abandoned by Apple, and after duplication
you have to spend half an hour assigning new audio outs etc arrrrggggg)

4) From a mono audio track output to mono = Logic cant you have to pan the out.

5) With 64 tracks all having plugs inserted try to figure out which track the plug you are editing belongs to = You cant as Logic does not alter the plug-in color. Good luck. Only remedy is bypassing the plug and try to remember which one it was after re-enabling it.

6) When playing back 64 track hit stop. In PT everything stops in logic it sounds as if you are a putting a halt to a scrub.

7) Create 24 groups and have them all default to a certain behavior. No no you have gotta tick all those 24 groups yourself.

8) Try adding incremented outputs/inputs to 64 tracks. In PT select the tracks 1-64 hit shift+alt+command and select output 1 and boom you've got all 64 assigned in heartbeat. In logic, well YOU guessed it, you've gotta do it by yourself.

9) relying on Logic to actually caretake the groups you took half an hour to create.... HA HA - Logic will get enormously confused about its groups.

10) Gettin more than 16 individual outputs from any foreign VI

11) Try getting mono outs from any foreign VI

12) I COULD go on and on and on but I'll put a sock to it right here in case an Apple Employee reads this and decides to commit suicide


If ANY of you feel that PT is not cutting it for you, rest assured that Pt has ONE big caveat; it shoots a load of professional addiction intravenous into your brain. Spend a few hours or days with Logic and you'll be french kissing your HD rig once you get back...

Logic could be 284 bits for all I care and have naked ladies on its boot screen, PT will remain my DAW of choice.....

Call me a fanboy

[25ghosts]

Originally Posted by Dizzi45Z

I'll take well developed basics over crazy features any day. It is the well developed basics that will save me the most time in the long run.

Very well said. PT is so vast and monstrous innovative. I find myself thinking about features that I dont know whether exists "Perhaps if I hold down command and alt "this" could happen" and 99% of the time it works.
Almosts as if the PT would read your mind right before you wanna do something. Some scary Shi***

As a thread that I started a month ago (http://duc.digidesign.com/showthread.php?t=260460). Logic is nowhere near replacing Pro Tools. I'll use Logic for a few things here and there and when I have to use it with a client. But until I feel that Logic is as stable and as straight forward as Pro Tools, it will never be my first choice-especially when the session really matters and the deadline is right around the corner.

Logic is a purgatory of unfinished ideas with poor implementation. Apple has added so many exotic and colorful bugs to this software that it reminds me of some darn Piñada exploding.

[25ghosts]

Originally Posted by relaxo

Yeah, but this is not fair, Logic can so so many important/vital things that PT can't, like midi note re-mapping, creating new midi tracks by splitting by note...

Logic did that even before it did audio. Emagic concepted Logic as a midi sequencer. And Logic from version 1 thru to 5 were fantastic. I used it successfully for a decade until Jobs and his furious 1000 got the idea of acquiring Emagic. More and more of those old great features are simply VANISHING from Logic. Give Apple a few more years and you wont be able to do all those great midi things. The environment used to be Logic's great advantage. I have coded controller maps for all my hardware synthesizers in there: But the environment was too complicated for Apple who wanna keep it simple. Well a DAW aint simple. IMO.

... or freezing, or going to that AMAZING area on the right in Logic to browse and audition sounds, etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc...these are INVALUABLE AND ESSENTIAL. There are so many important and valuable things that one program can do that the other can't.

I have had SOOOOOO many problems with freezing that I eventually stopped using it. And the File Browser on the side, you talk of cant even sort correctly according to alphabet. It will sort the name 4370 Hertz before 69 Hertz. Just to provide you with one example. Besides that the OS X Finder is a whole lot better at browsing than Logic's BIN.

I'll dare to say that Logic can do twice as many things as ProTools, but half as well.

I dont agree with that at all. Like I said I used Logic for more than a decade and know it inside out. Then I came to PT (Reluctantly as Apple killed stability of what I used to work with) and was Jaw-Dropped by the sheer amount of possibilities that PT offers. My assessment would be - Protools has 4 times the amount of sheer features of Logic. Whereas 75% of all Logic's features are buggy.

If PT died today and I HAD to use Logic. I would purchase a G4 dual and run Logic 5 on OS 9. And I mean that

[relaxo]

Originally Posted by 25ghosts

well a daw aint simple. Imo.

A M E N !!!!

I knew too that Logic was scr#wed when Apple bought it, but Apple has done a good gob of not destroying a lot of Logic power. They're polar opposites, Logic and Apple simplicity.

Apple oversimplifying design by limiting important features can be a huge PITA, sooooooo annoying and damaging sometimes.

Like:
-the entire Performa line, everything was limited, restrictive.
-why no mono mode on iPod? what if you want to share headphones or have a broken side on you earbuds? Just don't listen to any late 60's music, that's for sure!

[Syn-g]

Originally Posted by 25ghosts

I dont agree with that at all. Like I said I used Logic for more than a decade and know it inside out. Then I came to PT (Reluctantly as Apple killed stability of what I used to work with) and was Jaw-Dropped by the sheer amount of possibilities that PT offers. My assessment would be - Protools has 4 times the amount of sheer features of Logic. Whereas 75% of all Logic's features are buggy.

If PT died today and I HAD to use Logic. I would purchase a G4 dual and run Logic 5 on OS 9. And I mean that

I hear U......
Logic was mostly stable back then..... Still had a lot of bugs but not nearly as many as now.
I too have coded a lot of customization for my studio into Logic and until Apple figures out how to update Logic in a manner that does not require the user to totally reprogram their templates, (spending hours if not days) I will not be giving them another penny of my money. It's just ridiculous what is necessary to update Logic in a complex studio environment.
As much as I hate Logic, What I love about it, and the only reason i still use it is the FEEL. Still the best IMHO. Great for starting a song, getting it 30% there then transferring into PT for everything else.

[elambo]

This is great news. I've been running out of memory too often with Logic samplers. Unfortunately in 64-bit mode things like video output don't work, which is a deal breaker for me. 32-bit mode for any sessions using video.

[BGMusic]

Originally Posted by elambo

This is great news. I've been running out of memory too often with Logic samplers. Unfortunately in 64-bit mode things like video output don't work, which is a deal breaker for me. 32-bit mode for any sessions using video.

The Logic sampler, exs24 can access more than 4 gbs of memory in 32 bit mode.

You can't even bounce to mp3 in 64bit. It's a useless toy.

[burningbusch]

Originally Posted by relaxo

Yeah, but this is not fair, Logic can do so many important/vital things that PT can't and (vise versa), like midi note re-mapping, creating new midi tracks by splitting by note, or freezing, or going to that AMAZING area on the right in Logic to browse and audition sounds, etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc...these are INVALUABLE AND ESSENTIAL. Hell, Pro Tools doesn't even have an incoming/outgoing midi monitor window...also invaluable for troubleshooting midi connectivity and for programming samplers and drum machines. .

You can remap in the MIDI Editor by selecting a note on the keyboard which selects all instances of that note and then drag them to whatever pitch. Also the transpose is available and has some variations.

You can split notes to individual MIDI tracks. Use Event-> Event Operations -> Select/Split Notes. At the bottom is a dialog for selecting notes on new tracks.

While there is no input monitor per se you can use the Event List as an output MIDI monitor. The Event List can be used as a poor man's MIDI input monitor.

Busch.

[burningbusch]

Kontakt 3.5 and 4.0 support the utilization of RAM beyond 4GB on 32 bit systems. Spectrasonics just announced 64-bit versions of Omnisphere and Trillium and also a new “Sample File Server” for 32-bit Mac OSX systems to allow memory usage above 4GB.

Busch.

[djkiller]

Damn guys why is this turning into a protools vs logic thing. Buyers remorse much? I have both and both are great k, moving on :)

I've been running logic 64 putting it through real world use all day. well the biggest issue i have had is "32 Bit Audio Unit Bridge quit unexpectedly while using :insert plug name" comes up and crashes logic on many occasions. I haven't really gone over 3.85 gigs or so and my latency is the same as well as my sample rate pretty much. A few Plugs won't open and a few like the moog plugins won't open and ask for the cd library so i'm guessing any plugin dependent much on libraries might do this. So far antres moog and ez drummer have failed me, and psp audio vintage warmer has crapped out on me once or twice when loading. you really shouldn't touch anything at all till it has sat for a min after it opens.

It's nice but the stability with some of my sessions and plugs kinda sucks right now. The 32 bit audio bridge is my biggest issue right now :P other than that i like it. might have to go back to the version before for stability. Well that was hopeful wishing :)

I have 7gb ram...is there any way that maybe the ram is getting swapped around weird and i'm hitting the 32 bit bridge max and i don't have enough ram to run everything smooth? just a thought.