Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Pro Tools Software > Pro Tools

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #131  
Old 12-19-2023, 01:19 AM
Fiedler Audio Fiedler Audio is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2023
Location: Germany
Posts: 4
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

Quote:
Originally Posted by massivekerry View Post
Hi Thomas,

I'm curious. Is this from the Known Issues part of the PT "Read Me" doc, or is there a public-facing PT bug page? That bug isn't listed in the 2023.12 release docs.

I don't know if you can find it there. My info is from the known issues list published with the AAX SDK. It seems that they have another list of bugs there. But it also shows that they know about this problem for a looooong time.
Reply With Quote
  #132  
Old 01-19-2024, 04:23 AM
RobertDorn RobertDorn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 436
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

No it's never been listed in the known issues section of the public release notes. And it's also persistent in all versions of pro tools, so wether its artist studio or ultimate. Hope they will finally get this fixed this year because it's too bad that such a comprehensive daw isn't able to delay compensate properly.
__________________
Apple MacBook Pro M2 Max, 96GB ram | Pro Tools HDX | Avid MTRX | Pro Tools Ultimate 2023.12 | macOS 13.6.3
Reply With Quote
  #133  
Old 03-26-2024, 06:19 AM
masterplan masterplan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 85
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

So it was, again, with sadness I realized that the midi clock-ADC debacle still isn't fixed.
Given the addition of Midi plugins in 2024.3, I kind of assumed this would finally be taken care of.
It's been like this forever.
But no.

In case you haven't tried or noticed, take any plugin that uses midi clock (I'm guessing) to produce timing based effects, like Waves Pumper.
When your session grows with delay inducing plugins and/or routings, the timing of these kinds of plugins goes out the window.
In the case of Pumper, all you can do is constantly adjust the setting of the plugins to compensate for the increasing latency.
A terrible and cumbersome way of working that doesn't exist in Logic or Live for instance.
And this is still true on HDX, Hybrid or any playback engine, as far as I can tell.

@Marianna any possibilty this will ever be looked into?

// Peer
Reply With Quote
  #134  
Old 03-26-2024, 06:40 AM
marianna's Avatar
marianna marianna is offline
Avid
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Apollo Beach Florida
Posts: 601
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

Quote:
Originally Posted by masterplan View Post
So it was, again, with sadness I realized that the midi clock-ADC debacle still isn't fixed.
Given the addition of Midi plugins in 2024.3, I kind of assumed this would finally be taken care of.
It's been like this forever.
But no.

In case you haven't tried or noticed, take any plugin that uses midi clock (I'm guessing) to produce timing based effects, like Waves Pumper.
When your session grows with delay inducing plugins and/or routings, the timing of these kinds of plugins goes out the window.
In the case of Pumper, all you can do is constantly adjust the setting of the plugins to compensate for the increasing latency.
A terrible and cumbersome way of working that doesn't exist in Logic or Live for instance.
And this is still true on HDX, Hybrid or any playback engine, as far as I can tell.

@Marianna any possibilty this will ever be looked into?

// Peer
Hi Peer......

This was before I took over the duc so let me look into the bug and see what the status is and report back.....

Back soon....
Marianna
__________________
Marianna Montague
Sr. Dir. CX and Community | Customer Advocate

[email protected]
cell +1 (813) 493-6800
AOL IM avidmarianna
Twitter Avidmarianna


We're Avid. Learn more at www.avid.com
Reply With Quote
  #135  
Old 03-26-2024, 06:50 AM
masterplan masterplan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 85
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

Quote:
Originally Posted by marianna View Post
Hi Peer......

This was before I took over the duc so let me look into the bug and see what the status is and report back.....

Back soon....
Marianna
Lovely!
Thank you!


// Peer
Reply With Quote
  #136  
Old 03-29-2024, 02:01 PM
Franklyn Franklyn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 1998
Location: Stuttgart, Germany
Posts: 415
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

The strange thing is that some plug ins are correct compensated.
f.e. shaper box 3 is absolute in time in my tests.
Reply With Quote
  #137  
Old 03-30-2024, 07:29 AM
Fiedler Audio Fiedler Audio is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2023
Location: Germany
Posts: 4
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Franklyn View Post
The strange thing is that some plug ins are correct compensated.
f.e. shaper box 3 is absolute in time in my tests.

Nope, it has the same problem. Timing gets out of synch if a latency producing plugin is before Shaperbox. Just tested it with the latest version of Pro Tools.
Reply With Quote
  #138  
Old 04-02-2024, 10:25 AM
RobertDorn RobertDorn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 436
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

Quote:
Originally Posted by marianna View Post
Hi Peer......

This was before I took over the duc so let me look into the bug and see what the status is and report back.....

Back soon....
Marianna
Hi Marianna!

Any news yet? What I experience over here: Cableguys Kickstart2 is running in sync now with Pro Tools 2024.3, but for instance Xfer LFO Tool is not. So it seems it differs per plugin. As for arpeggiated instrument patches (you know, hit one note and the arpeggiator inside the virtual instrument will start playing in sync with the bpm) no matter which third party vendor I check, they all still get out of sync once session delay adds up.
__________________
Apple MacBook Pro M2 Max, 96GB ram | Pro Tools HDX | Avid MTRX | Pro Tools Ultimate 2023.12 | macOS 13.6.3
Reply With Quote
  #139  
Old 04-10-2024, 03:56 AM
masterplan masterplan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 85
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

Quote:
Originally Posted by marianna View Post
Hi Peer......

This was before I took over the duc so let me look into the bug and see what the status is and report back.....

Back soon....
Marianna
Hi Marianna!

In order to hopefully get to the bottom of this age long crippling bug, I've attached 2 PT sessions, that shows this in it's bare essence.
If you could please forward these to your dev team, it would be great.

These sessions requires 4 simple plugins:
- Air Xpand 2
- Avid Maxim
- Avid Dyn3 Compressor/Limiter
- Waves Pumper

1. The session Midi Beat Latency
Shows what happens if you use a time based plugin.

2. The session Side Chain Latency
Shows what happens if you have a side chain triggering a compressor.

In these sessions, deactivate the tracks "Instrument Latency" and "Aux Latency".
Then you'll hear the Pumper and side chain compressor play in time.
When activated, the pumping effect in out of time.


In conclusion:
If you have a track with any type of latency going to the same output as the VI in question, the Pumper, or the side chain timing, goes out the window.
This goes for HDX, Hybrid Engine and Core.

Link to sessions:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/nue0d...7bjd4fnj7&dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/3agwx...5xpt6gll1&dl=0


Thank you!


// Peer

Last edited by masterplan; 04-10-2024 at 05:56 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #140  
Old 04-10-2024, 06:16 AM
marianna's Avatar
marianna marianna is offline
Avid
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Apollo Beach Florida
Posts: 601
Default Re: Plugins / Delay Compensation / Timing / Downbeat [PT-263943]

Quote:
Originally Posted by masterplan View Post
Hi Marianna!

In order to hopefully get to the bottom of this age long crippling bug, I've attached 2 PT sessions, that shows this in it's bare essence.
If you could please forward these to your dev team, it would be great.

These sessions requires 4 simple plugins:
- Air Xpand 2
- Avid Maxim
- Avid Dyn3 Compressor/Limiter
- Waves Pumper

1. The session Midi Beat Latency
Shows what happens if you use a time based plugin.

2. The session Side Chain Latency
Shows what happens if you have a side chain triggering a compressor.

In these sessions, deactivate the tracks "Instrument Latency" and "Aux Latency".
Then you'll hear the Pumper and side chain compressor play in time.
When activated, the pumping effect in out of time.


In conclusion:
If you have a track with any type of latency going to the same output as the VI in question, the Pumper, or the side chain timing, goes out the window.
This goes for HDX, Hybrid Engine and Core.

Link to sessions:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/nue0d...7bjd4fnj7&dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/3agwx...5xpt6gll1&dl=0

Thank you!

// Peer
Thank you Peers...... excellent info. I conversed with Mark one of our system engineers and it seems that it needs to be looked at again since engineering reported it fixed back in PT-267979 was closed as fixed back in 2020.12.

It will likely need to be reproduced with PT 24.3 and logged as a new bug which will happened and I will scan thru the posts and get all new people reporting it into the system and logged.

Mark is on it.
Marianna
__________________
Marianna Montague
Sr. Dir. CX and Community | Customer Advocate

[email protected]
cell +1 (813) 493-6800
AOL IM avidmarianna
Twitter Avidmarianna


We're Avid. Learn more at www.avid.com
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
MIDI timing / recording delays with Delay Compensation DAWgEAR Pro Tools 10 23 03-08-2020 06:12 AM
Delay Compensation screws up VI timing kirkbross Pro Tools 2019 13 07-16-2019 03:07 PM
Delay Compensation red with or without plugins donvision Pro Tools HDX & HD Native Systems (Win) 3 09-08-2013 08:34 PM
Delay Compensation Timing problems with RTAS plugs Kourquie Pro Tools TDM Systems (Mac) 2 07-22-2007 03:50 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:15 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com