> Fader Bank switching

[Howardk]

I work for an international classic rock artist. We do a lot of fly dates in the US and bump into every console imaginable. Although my favorite is still Midas analog, I do really like the sound quality and overall operating software of the Venue products. It is also great that a show can be used on any of the Venue platforms.

While I like the sound quality, I find it really hard to mix on these consoles because of the limited number of faders and the channel bank switching on the Profile and SC48 is a real setback.

I really need to have all my vocals and guitars available on faders at-all-times (8 channels) and have many other mix cues to get at with my other hand. If there was a way to switch banks 8 channels at a time (instead of all being ganged together) that would go a long way. The other approach would be multiple user channel layouts (mix templates), that the engineer could call up for the particular part of the show, with the required faders exposed in a user preferred order.

Unfortunately, due to the above, we will have to say NO to the SC48 on our rider next year, and even more unfortunate the Yamaha M7CL (although not listed as approved) will still get an off-rider yes for lower production value shows, because even though it does not sound great, I can do the mixing job on it.

I look forward to the day the control surface is completely virtual so that the engineer can set it up best for the job at hand, instead of a design engineer trying to guess what we need/prefer while working to save a few bucks on control knobs and faders. A shorter term approach would be an accessory controller thru a computer that we can setup specifics such as a dozen key FX sends, other key channels etc. . .

If there is a trick I am missing that will keep all my vocals on top at all times (and that the companies who own these consoles do not know about either), I would appreciate hearing. . . and yes I have optimized my program by moving things around and softpatching, making all stereo items a single fader, and while VCA spill is cool, it is not of any real advantage to me in the goal of simultaneous mixing of levels of a 40 input live show on so few faders.

[sonicboost]

Could you not "bank safe" those 8 channels? Or do you at some point still need to get under those as well?

[Howardk]

I did not know about bank safe, nor did the sound companies I came across that own the Profiles. It might do the trick and because I am using a lot of stereo in a mono space, so the blanks, plus a couple of open channels, end up under my vocs. . . so with MCs, and other surprise, inputs I might be able to squeak by without needing that bank. I would prefer to bank switch 8 strips at a time. . . or have totally flexible multiple layouts.

The bank safe feature does not save the SC48 for my purpose.

I am not liking the function switching implementation on the Profile either. A whole bunch of softkeys would have been nice. . . or a USB connected pad with 12-24 programmable softkeys as an option.

[sonicboost]

Another thing you can do with that since you say you have a lot of stereo channels, is strategically place 'blank strips' underneath the band safed ones. Thats one way I manage it. Just right click over the area where you want to drop in a "blank strip" and remember it always drops them in to the left of the fader you are clicking on.
I also have a few audience response mics that don't get routed anywhere but to some overflow rooms and recordings, so I never have to touch those. They live under bank safed channels as well.
Hope that helps!

[RAlvarez]

The Venue D-Show will allow you to do that...have them provide a Main + Side Car D-Show system and with it you can decide to keep your 8 channels always up while switching layers on the Side car and since you like the Midas consoles you'll like the D-Show more than any of the other control surfaces.

[sonicboost]

Yeah - I noticed you singled out the Profile and SC48, but like he said, there is a simple way to de-link the main and side cars from banking together. On the control surface, you can just hold down the "A" button under "Banks" on either the main or the side car until it flashes.
In the software you can de-link the encoders AND the fader banks under the "Interaction" tab of "Options". Look at the bottom right of the screen under "Control Surface" and you can choose to "Link Main and Sidecar(s)" for "fader banks" or "encoders".
Hope that helps.

[digidesigner]

Sheldon, are there any plans to have fully customizable user layer? In PT mixer we can drag the faders around anyway we like, should be easy to do on Venue as well, no?

[Chris Lambrechts]

Originally Posted by digidesigner

Sheldon, are there any plans to have fully customizable user layer? In PT mixer we can drag the faders around anyway we like, should be easy to do on Venue as well, no?

Hi K,

You can do this on a venue system as well using the 'move selected strips here' feature available when right clicking on the channel strips in the GUI.

example :

- select channels 1, 2 and 3
- right click on channel 10
- select 'move selected strips' here.

Result : channels 1,2 and 3 are now channels 7,8 and 9.

a few 'rules' to keep in mind :

- selected channels will move left of target channel
- only custom channel names will follow the channel to it's new position. Meaning that if you want to move channel 1 and you named it 'kick', after you move the channel left of say channel 15, channel 14 will now be named 'kick'. if that channel has the default name : 'Ch 1', then after the move that channel will be named 'Ch 14'. I hope that makes sense ... it's A LOT easier to actually do then to explain. Try it ... it will make sense.
- non continuous selections, eg. selecting Ch 1, 5 and 7, will become adjacent channels after the move ... similar to Pro Tools behavior when doing that.

I can see how the 'Pro Tools' way of drag and drop may seem more convenient but in Venue's case I think it makes sense. You have to make a very conscious selection of channels and then move them left of a 'target' channel by selecting the 'move selected channels here' option. You will not drop a channel somewhere by accident. To some extend I wish Pro Tools would do the same to be honest ... specifically in large track count sessions.


Chris

[Howardk]

I have my input channel arranged for what works best for the majority of things, and which is different for each of the venue control surfaces, but it is still a compromise. I would like to see multiple user layouts that would hide/show, or even better rearrange the channels to positions I like, depending on what I am up to in the song etc. . . let's coin it as "Flex Channel Arrangement" This could be menu driven from the screen (almost like using Hide/show and memory locations in ProTools), and the user could link the different layouts to function keys.

Although none of the other common digital consoles have this, I think it would be well revered and give the Venue series another "edge"

[digidesigner]

Originally Posted by Chris Lambrechts

Hi K,

You can do this on a venue system as well using the 'move selected strips here' feature available when right clicking on the channel strips in the GUI.

example :

- select channels 1, 2 and 3
- right click on channel 10
- select 'move selected strips' here.

Result : channels 1,2 and 3 are now channels 7,8 and 9.

a few 'rules' to keep in mind :

- selected channels will move left of target channel
- only custom channel names will follow the channel to it's new position. Meaning that if you want to move channel 1 and you named it 'kick', after you move the channel left of say channel 15, channel 14 will now be named 'kick'. if that channel has the default name : 'Ch 1', then after the move that channel will be named 'Ch 14'. I hope that makes sense ... it's A LOT easier to actually do then to explain. Try it ... it will make sense.
- non continuous selections, eg. selecting Ch 1, 5 and 7, will become adjacent channels after the move ... similar to Pro Tools behavior when doing that.

I can see how the 'Pro Tools' way of drag and drop may seem more convenient but in Venue's case I think it makes sense. You have to make a very conscious selection of channels and then move them left of a 'target' channel by selecting the 'move selected channels here' option. You will not drop a channel somewhere by accident. To some extend I wish Pro Tools would do the same to be honest ... specifically in large track count sessions.


Chris

Hi Chris, thanks for the info! The console is boxed up and I only can test stuff with the standalone.. I'm on mac laptop so no right click in windows :)
Looking forward to meet you in Tallinn!