Anyone using the Mackie C4 plugin controller?

[PTLExp]

I own the MCU and am considering getting this one for more plugin control. It works great with LE, but on the Mackie page, they make absolutely no reference to Pro Tools for this unit, wondering if any of you use it:

http://www.mackie.com/products/c4/

[PTLExp]

Well, I should have probably posted this question BEFORE I went and searched Mackie's forum, and this is what I found (apparently from a Mackie rep):

"In addition to the three DAWs that the C4 currently works with (Logic 7 Express or Pro, Sonar 3 or 4, and Tracktion 2) C4 support is currently being coded and tested with 2 more additional programs (sorry, not at liberty to say which ones). In addition, we're always pestering other companies to add C4 support, as our goal is to have this fine piece o' gear work with as many programs as possible.
However, it is very unlikely that it will ever work with Pro Tools. These days, Digidesign prefers to make their own hardware controllers and does not really work with other companies like us. We were able to get around this on the Mackie Control, by having it emulate a HUI (a product from the days when they did work with companies like us). For the C4 however, there's nothing digi-compatible for it to emulate. Of course we'd love for the C4 to work with Pro Tools, but it's really digidesign's call and there's not much we can do about it."

-I guess the better question would have been:

Hey Digidesign, you guys ever plan on supporting this thing?

[A2D D2A]

Why would they?
DIGI already offers better solutions.
Look at the cost of 24 faders worth of MCU and extenders, then add in a C4 and the DIGI options don't look as expensive.
Also another thing to consider is would the C4 work as well as something like the C8 in FLIP Mode for controlling parameters?

[aliengroover]

Point me to the "better" solutions. Keep it affordable, though. A 24-channel Mackie system with the C4 would run you $3400 (MCU=1000, Extenders=700 each, C4=1000). Even a 32 channel hookup would only be $4400. That's a heck of hookup if you have the real estate. What Digi option runs you less than $4400? And as far as the flip function, I don't believe I'm the only one who's gotten along just fine without it. IMHO, I think more people clamor for knobs to edit plug-ins than they do for faders. Though I'd say faders are a bit better for automating the plugs, it's not exactly a chore to do them with knobs.
Peace

[aliengroover]

BTW, I think it stinks that there isn't any support for it. I'd bet that there's a pretty sizable user base of MCU/ProTools users. A C4 would be a killer addition. But hey, Digi has nothing at all to gain by implementing it. Zero. So don't bet on it.

Only thing to hope for at this point is that they make their own knob controller.
Peace

[A2D D2A]

Point me to the "better" solutions. Keep it affordable, though. A 24-channel Mackie system with the C4 would run you $3400 (MCU=1000, Extenders=700 each, C4=1000). Even a 32 channel hookup would only be $4400. That's a heck of hookup if you have the real estate. What Digi option runs you less than $4400? And as far as the flip function, I don't believe I'm the only one who's gotten along just fine without it. IMHO, I think more people clamor for knobs to edit plug-ins than they do for faders. Though I'd say faders are a bit better for automating the plugs, it's not exactly a chore to do them with knobs.
Peace

Control 24

[A2D D2A]

BTW, I think it stinks that there isn't any support for it. I'd bet that there's a pretty sizable user base of MCU/ProTools users. A C4 would be a killer addition. But hey, Digi has nothing at all to gain by implementing it. Zero. So don't bet on it.

Only thing to hope for at this point is that they make their own knob controller.
Peace

The integration of the MCU is really lacking, it doesn't even have all the capabilities of the original HUI.
Mackie is pretty full of it to expect vendors to jump on the C4, they originally announced it and gave it a release date how many years ago????
It became a dead product for several years.
They went through a company restructure and finally released the product many years late.
Why support a product that like that?
The C4 was originally advertised to be available shortly after the Mackie Control, so now that it has finally shown up most have moved on.
If DIGI wanted to support knobs it would be a better move to just offer a knobby unit than to support the C4.
DIGI has yet to address the C8 expansion aspect yet and they could easily do the two in one stroke if they so desired.
Then again they are offering the new bundles so who knows what else they may offer.

[aliengroover]

How much is the Control 24 again? New? That's what I thought.

And tell me how the MCU is lacking in integration? I hear this ALL the time, but it's a fact that the MCU accesses more features in PT than the 002 and C8 (don't say the Control 24, 'cause that's a whole 'nother market). Correct me if I'm wrong, but where's the jog/shuttle wheel, automation enabling/selection, dedicated save button, marker location, cut, dedicated record arms, clear peaks and group buttons? IIRC, they don't exist on the 002. It's not a pissing contest, but it's highly misleading to those contemplating one of these units when you say that the MCU lacks in integration.

BTW, I do agree that it's Mackie's fault for putting everyone on hold with the C4, but that still doesn't stop it from being an enticing product. They're not the first, nor will they be the last, company to have a major delay on a product. But now that it's out, what excuse is there, other than they just don't want to?
Peace

[A2D D2A]

It's not hard to pull off a C24 for $5.5k most dealers who have them want to move them.
The MCU like everything else that uses HUI emulation lacks the capability of the original HUI.
I have owned 2 HUI's (in tandem), a MCU + EXT and a C24.
Using the MCU made me realize how much better the HUI was.
Fortunately I had gotten the MCU and EXT pretty cheap and they were an easy sell since they were still 4 months out the box.

The thing that would scare me about the C4 would be the MIDI communication, MCU's and HUI's still do strange things when multipled on PT systems with that emulated MIDI port and the C4 would be along the same lines.
People with similar systems have always gotten varied results using the same MIDI interface.

As for the C8 it always seemed lke an interim product, more like a work in progress than a complete product.
Somewhat like they held the line so it would not affect the 002's feature set.
Still it controls the parameters for plugs pretty good and that's one of the places Mackie thinned down on the MCU compared to the HUI.
If the C4 would have shown up on time it would have taken care of that, but it didn't.

[PTLExp]

"The MCU like everything else that uses HUI emulation lacks the capability of the original HUI."

Uh, you DO know that Mackie were the creators of the HUI for Pro Tools, right? Sure, the MCU doesn't have everything the original HUI did and that's because the HUI also had an independent talk-back section, which the MCU doesn't, so you can't expect them to be the same, but you know what else? The older HUI unit won't even work with the newer versions of Pro Tools, how about that!?

As far as FLIP mode, the MCU already does this and I can use knobs or faders to control plugins, thanks to the HUI commands that Mackie created in conjunction with Pro Tools.

Aliengroover is fully on point, it's all about Digidesign's decision not to support a fine line of controllers based on the fact that they have a line of controllers they want everyone to use. Or tell me that I'm full of it and that I can use these control surfaces with other platforms, like say, Adobe Audition?

And to answer your question as to why would they: simple - not everyone wants to blow 5K on a control surface that does the same thing that a combination that costs much less does.