Amplitube + automation

[Carl Kolchak]

Decided to retrospectively add some Wah-Wah to a guitar solo that was recorded straight.

The actual Wah automation is fine, but having set up the Wah mode switch for automation (so that the pedal is only activated for the solo), I'm finding that the automation lane in Pro Tools only allows 2 automation states :

1. On

2. Auto

The switch on the pedal has 3 states (On, Auto, and most importantly, Off).

I need the pedal completely disengaged / off for the duration of the song, except for the solo.

Anybody know how to automate that all important 3rd state in Amplitube? :

3. Off



Thanks for any help here.

[nst7]

Hopefully someone knows the answer, but in the meantime, couldn't you just move the solo to its own separate track?

[musicman691]

Now I'm not sure how the wah pedal in Amplitube works but the Teese RMC3 wah I have sounds like it's not having any effect on the sound when it's all the way up. Most real-world wahs tend to act that way and maybe the Amplitube one does as well so when the wah is 'on' send it a controller message that it's all the way 'up'. That is unless you're trying to do a Clapton where he tended to use the wah as a static filter versus like he did on White Room with plenty of movement in the pedal (and sound).

[Carl Kolchak]

Originally Posted by nst7

Hopefully someone knows the answer, but in the meantime, couldn't you just move the solo to its own separate track?

That was my first conclusion, but I was trying to avoid doing that. Instead I set the Wah pedal to the "off" position, and placed the Plug & Mix Wah-Wah upstream of Amplitube, cutting & pasting the automation to the P&M plugin.

That had the advantage of more flexibility, and intelligibility - although I did rather like the sound of the Amplitube Wah-Wah.

I guess there's no way of doing it within Amplitube itself

[Carl Kolchak]

Originally Posted by musicman691

Now I'm not sure how the wah pedal in Amplitube works but the Teese RMC3 wah I have sounds like it's not having any effect on the sound when it's all the way up. Most real-world wahs tend to act that way and maybe the Amplitube one does as well so when the wah is 'on' send it a controller message that it's all the way 'up'. That is unless you're trying to do a Clapton where he tended to use the wah as a static filter versus like he did on White Room with plenty of movement in the pedal (and sound).

The only Wah pedals I've ever used are the Jim Dunlop Crybaby, and the Morley classic, and mini Wah.

All of those filtered the signal when activated :

Morley by means of a dedicated stomp switch (meaning the effect could be engaged in any filter position desired).

Dunlop Crybaby by means of bearing down on the rocker pedal, at the top of it's throw (meaning the effect engaged loud and proud at the top of it's filter range).

Whilst the Amplitube Wah seems closest to the Crybaby (to me at least), unfortunately the switching doesn't behave the same.

The upshot is, it's either on or off, and if it's on, it's distinctively filtering the signal - so unfortunately there is no bypass position.

I find it hard to believe IK screwed up on this, but it's a head scratcher.

Maybe it's a limitation of Pro Tools that I haven't run in to before (that an automation switch lane can only have two states, rather than three or more)?

Cheers guys!

[musicman691]

Originally Posted by Carl Kolchak

The only Wah pedals I've ever used are the Jim Dunlop Crybaby, and the Morley classic, and mini Wah.

All of those filtered the signal when activated :

Morley by means of a dedicated stomp switch (meaning the effect could be engaged in any filter position desired).

Dunlop Crybaby by means of bearing down on the rocker pedal, at the top of it's throw (meaning the effect engaged loud and proud at the top of it's filter range).

Whilst the Amplitube Wah seems closest to the Crybaby (to me at least), unfortunately the switching doesn't behave the same.

The upshot is, it's either on or off, and if it's on, it's distinctively filtering the signal - so unfortunately there is no bypass position.

I find it hard to believe IK screwed up on this, but it's a head scratcher.

Maybe it's a limitation of Pro Tools that I haven't run in to before (that an automation switch lane can only have two states, rather than three or more)?

Cheers guys!

All those switches do are to switch the wah into the circuit. What actually gives the wah depth (makes it take effect) is rocking the pedal back and forth. A wah has no effect on the circuit when it's fully in the up position (at least my Teese doesn't). My Teese is like the Dunlop with a dpdt push switch activated with the pedal in the fully down position. The DPDT makes it true bypass in this case. Granted it does come on like gangbusters like you say but bring the pedal all the way back up and there's essentially no effect on the signal.

I would not give up that RMC3 of mine - fully adjustable for sweep position, width, freq boost, etc. Can emulate most any wah out there.

[Carl Kolchak]

Originally Posted by musicman691

A wah has no effect on the circuit when it's fully in the up position (at least my Teese doesn't).

There is no "defeat" position on the Jim Dunlop Crybaby, nor the Amplitube emulation.

I seem to remember the Morley was defeated with the pedal rocked fully to the back, but I may have remembered that wrong.

Never tried a Teese, but I preferred the sound of the Dunlop over the Morely, so if it sounds more like the Crybaby it's worth checking out.

The thing I preferred about the Morley over the Dunlop, was that I believe the Morley worked using an optocoupler vs the Dunlop's traditional potentiometer. Inevitably my Dunlop suffered from a dirty / crackly pot, and no replacement ever sounded right. The Morley would never suffer from a dirty Wah signal for that reason.

Anyway, you may be able to see / hear the lack of "defeat" position on the Dunlop, in this video.

[musicman691]

Originally Posted by Carl Kolchak

There is no "defeat" position on the Jim Dunlop Crybaby, nor the Amplitube emulation.

I seem to remember the Morley was defeated with the pedal rocked fully to the back, but I may have remembered that wrong.

Never tried a Teese, but I preferred the sound of the Dunlop over the Morely, so if it sounds more like the Crybaby it's worth checking out.

The thing I preferred about the Morley over the Dunlop, was that I believe the Morley worked using an optocoupler vs the Dunlop's traditional potentiometer. Inevitably my Dunlop suffered from a dirty / crackly pot, and no replacement ever sounded right. The Morley would never suffer from a dirty Wah signal for that reason.

Anyway, you may be able to see / hear the lack of "defeat" position on the Dunlop, in this video.

The RMC3 can be made to sound like most any other wah with the same type of inductor and that's what a lot of people don't understand - the type of inductor used has a HUGE difference on the sound. There's one manufacturer and I can't remember who, but they offer a wah with the 2 major inductor types used. Teese has newer version of my wah but they can be difficult to get as they're in the 'boutique' category and aren't mass produced.

Ahh - crackly wah pot - the bane of most wah users. I've been fortunate in that mone has never gone too bad. Just a shot of tuner contact cleaner and working the control back and forth a few times cures the problem.

Also didn't the Morley use a sensor system so that it was activated just by stepping on the pedal? I believe Vai's Bad Horsie was that way.

[Carl Kolchak]

Originally Posted by musicman691

Also didn't the Morley use a sensor system so that it was activated just by stepping on the pedal? I believe Vai's Bad Horsie was that way.

I think it depends on the model. The ones I had featured a stomp button to the side of the pedal, but others, such as the fuzz-wah, had a stomp on one side to activate the fuzz, and another stomp on the other side to activate the wah, but if the wah was not active, the pedal controlled volume.

I seem to remember coming across a wah that was activated by giving the pedal a sideways twist with your foot - don't remember if that was a mass produced thing, or a custom job. It was 20 something years ago, and I'm not really a wah aficionado.