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  #11  
Old 01-22-2025, 12:51 AM
JFreak's Avatar
JFreak JFreak is offline
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Default Re: Mtrx Studio Thunderbolt multiple devices ?

Wow. I am so outdated with this Apogee Symphony that has thunderbolt and digilink, having to reboot the device to switch between the two
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  #12  
Old 01-22-2025, 01:12 AM
dif dif is offline
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Default Re: Mtrx Studio Thunderbolt multiple devices ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darryl Ramm View Post
What do you want to do with this?

It is extremely unlikely any manufacturer would deliver ability to simultaneously/dividable multiple host a Thunderbolt interface.

For simpler exclusive access between two hosts on a bus, maybe for failover redundancy, you could try it. That would likely take some easier engineering but it is also not documented anywhere AFAIK so expect it will not work either.
Thanks

I want:

- My Mac Protools HDX on digilink
- The same Mac on thunderbolt
- My PC on thunderbolt.

I don't need to use both thunderbolt devices at the same time, it's ok if I can switch the driver.

But connecting my PC on Dante DVS seems to be a good choice.
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  #13  
Old 01-22-2025, 04:14 PM
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shawnhonsberger shawnhonsberger is offline
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Default Re: Mtrx Studio Thunderbolt multiple devices ?

Wow, so cool!
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System Details:
Apple Mac Studio M2 Ultra 24 Core CPU, 60 Core GPU
192GB Unified Memory, 4 TB SSD
Apple iPad Pro M2 (12.9-inch) (6th generation)

I/O + Control Surfaces:
AVID Pro Tools | MTRX Studio (TB3 Native)
AVID Thunderbolt 3 Option Module:
RTL (96k): 1.2ms at 32 samples, 1.8ms at 64 samples
RTL (48k): 2.3ms at 32 samples, 3.6ms at 64 samples
AVID S1 EUCON Controller
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Software:
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AVID Pro Tools Ultimate 2024.10.2
AVID EUCON 2024.10
AVID Control 2024.10
Dolby Atmos Renderer 5.3.0
SoundFlow 5.10.1
Scheps MOMDeck
Apple Logic Pro 11.1.2
SoundID Reference for Multichannel 5.12.1

Drivers:
AVID MTRX Studio Firmware 1.1.5.1
AVID DADman 5.8.0.8
AVID DADTBDriver CoreAudio 1.2.2

Dolby Atmos 9.1.4 Monitoring:
Kali Audio IN-8 V2 (9)
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Kali Audio IN-5 (4)
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  #14  
Old 01-22-2025, 05:42 PM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is offline
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Default Re: Mtrx Studio Thunderbolt multiple devices ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dif View Post
Thanks

I want:

- My Mac Protools HDX on digilink
- The same Mac on thunderbolt
- My PC on thunderbolt.

I don't need to use both thunderbolt devices at the same time, it's ok if I can switch the driver.
So three options to consider, in increasing levels of less likely to work/sheer craziness.

1/ Just plugging and unplugging a Thunderbolt cable. You might be able to make this easier with a Thunderbolt hub/dock placed in a convenient location so you don't need to reach back around the computers and MTRX Studio. Try to keep Thunderbolt cable runs short, make sure you are using proper certified Thunderbolt 3/4 cables or for longer runs consider using Corning optical cables.

2/ You _might_ also be able to use a Thunderbolt KVM switch like a SABRENT Thunderbolt 4 KVM Switch to do the switching, it will depend on how these are implemented internally but the do switch the PCIe lanes, there may be some issues with Thunderbolt 3 vs Thunderbolt 4, but you could test one and see. There is a shortage of good Thunderbolt KVM products, and this model have issues with slow display switching etc, so maybe not the greatest as a KVM switch, but here you only need to see if it will switch the PCIe lanes over Thunderbolt OK in your setup. Test carefully, e.g. don't have audio monitors connected in case of loud damaging noises.

3/ To get this to switch between two computers without a KVM switch with both computers having permanent Thunderbolt connections to the MTRX Studio at a minimum you likely need to have the lowest level Thunderbolt device driver for the MTRX Studio enabled on one computer and disabled on the other. This is kinda a crazy thing to try, and I don't have a MTRX Studio here to test with, so you would need to experiment with your setup. And hey doing that because some guy online suggested it sure seems crazy to me. In the small chance this actually works the manual steps here could be automated, wrapped in some software, to make the switch over easier. I'm not sure any of that is really worth doing vs all the other options here, but for me this is more a curiosity...

The problem with multiple computers on a Thunderbolt bus like this is the first computer to see the interface will load a driver and start the initial setup with the device, the next computer may try to do the same and may fail in some way. The Thunderbolt interface is unlikely to have been designed or tested to handle this, who knows what it might do, the MTRX Studio might hang and need to be power cycled, it might cause the audio driver in the other computer to fail/crash, it might cause one or both computers to crash. The MTRX might put out horrible damaging noises on attached monitors. etc. etc.

First make sure that both computers work individually over Thunderbolt with the interface, I would install the latest drivers. Make sure there are no other peripherals on the bus.

With two computers connected you likely need to disable the drivers on one of the computers to stop it trying to connect to the MTRX Studio. With only the PC connected to the MTRX Studio under Windows Device Manager... find the interface and on the Driver tab click the Disable button. (I've only ever briefly looked at a MTRX Studio on a Mac but that should be there).
Then with the PC driver disabled connect the Mac to the other Thunderbolt port on the MTRX Studio and see what happens, see if it finds the MTRX Studio over Thunderbolt and works or not.

Now to switch to the PC you would disable the Mac driver and re-enable the PC:

On the Mac in System Settings > General > Driver Extensions. Click on the (...) button and click on the Delete Extension to disable the driver. Accept the warnings about possibly needing to reboot (but don't reboot) and enter your password when prompted.

On the PC in Device manager click on the Device Enable button (what was previously the Disable button).

In the long shot that worked. You can try switching back again:

On the PC disable the driver in Device Manager

To reenable the driver on the Mac launch the DADDriverSetup application and follow the pop-up dialogs there and go though the approval steps to start up the DriverKit driver similar to when you first installed the driver. You must go the the Driver Extensions settings and slide the enable button on for "DADDriverSetup.app" (that's always just the name of the setup app, the user space Driver Kit driver is actually hidden inside that setup utility).

( If the Mac does not do this OK then in Terminal run:

$ systemextensionsctl list
$ systemextensionsctl reset

save the output from list, and after doing the reset and try again. The $ here is just the shell prompt, it will be different on your Mac, you don't type that part )

And I'm assuming here you just ignore DADman to start with and then you have or can get DADman running over Ethernet here to both computers and not Thunderbolt and I've not even thought about the details there.

----

Have I mentioned this is crazy to try? Now I don't expect you can permanently damage anything. Thunderbolt is constructed at the lowest levels so that plugging different things together should not harm things. But please do initial tests with studio monitors etc. disconnected in case of damaging loud noises. And hey if it does damage something then hopefully the MTRX Studio is under warranty and let me know and I'll delete this post Have I mentioned this is crazy to try?

If I had a MTRX Studio here I'd test this, I have done things like this with audio devices when testing stuff between virtual machines and host OSes, smacking the drivers back and forwards like this.

Quote:
But connecting my PC on Dante DVS seems to be a good choice.
DVS has high latency and typically more issues than Dante using Dante hardware. I would personally stay away from it, but it depends on what you are doing, you can always just try it and see. Dante as a routing solution here, including for high availability/redundancy can be very nice.
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