Avid Pro Audio Community

Avid Pro Audio Community

How to Join & Post  •  Community Terms of Use  •  Help Us Help You

Knowledge Base Search  •  Community Search  •  Learn & Support


Avid Home Page

Go Back   Avid Pro Audio Community > Pro Tools Software > macOS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #61  
Old 05-11-2022, 11:22 AM
jimmygu33 jimmygu33 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2022
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 3
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

Quote:
Originally Posted by smurfyou View Post
I think you'll be just fine HD Native. It can do so much more than HDX1.

There are definitely enclosures you can use with your 2.5" SSD's. I use a USB3.1 box. The "OWC Mercury Elite Pro Dual Mini", quite a mouthful. Personally I haven't felt Thunderbolt is necessary given the price difference. m.2 NVME disks are becoming much more common so if you have to buy something you might want to look at those to help future proof your setup. They are faster but run hotter than what you have now. As they talk about in that article above.

I'd suggest trying out the HDMI output. You might get by just fine. Lots of folks seem to do it. I prefer using an Aja but I'm unclear on the M1 compatibility for those at the moment.

Thanks a lot! I ordered the Native and a couple of docks for the SSDs and HDDs.
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 05-11-2022, 11:25 AM
jimmygu33 jimmygu33 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2022
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 3
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Lambert View Post
My studio in Chicago uses an OWC Mercury Elite 2-drive chassis for its 2.5" SSDs and it's been solid. In my LA studio I have a similar OWC 4-drive TB4 chassis which has also been great. Prior to that I used the same 2-drive chassis that's in Chicago. None have ever been an issue.

In large sessions, I'm happy to know that I have the data throughput of TB4 so that there's no chance for bottlenecks (even if there wouldn't have been with USB3 either, but peace of mind counts for something), and also because the new Mac Studio Ultras have so many individual TB4 ports.

Also, I use HD Native and feel completely happy with it.

Thanks for the info, Eric!
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 05-11-2022, 09:36 PM
kings79's Avatar
kings79 kings79 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 278
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmygu33 View Post
Hey folks, hope it's ok to post this here. I do TV post on a 2010 cheesegrater mac PT Ultimate HDX system, and decided the Mac Studio w M1 Max was what I have been waiting for so I took the plunge. It was supposed to arrive in June, but I just got an email saying it will be here in a week, so I need to get my act together as far as peripherals and storage solutions. Here's what I have and what I'm thinking of transitioning to. Any advice would be appreciated.


HDX PCI-e card > Thunderbolt HD Native
192 I/O > no change
Audio Drive: Sonnet Dual 2.5" SSD RAID (4TB) > need solution for this
2 SATA HDDs for Time Machine & SFX library > OWC USB-C Dock
Blackmagic Mini Monitor PCI-e (for TV monitor)> MS HDMI port


I am trying to avoid using a PCI-e expansion chassis, but could do that if it makes more sense. I really don't like the fan noise from my HDX card, and I'm thinking the MS will be so powerful that the glorified dongle HD Native will be just fine to interface with my 192. I see that Sonnet offers some thunderbolt SSD RAID solutions but I'm unclear whether there's a device I could just pop my existing SSDs into or if I need new SSDs of a smaller form factor. I'm thinking of just running my client TV as a 3rd monitor via the HDMI port and dragging my PT video there when needed, which isn't often, as most of my clients are remote.


Anyway, thanks in advance for any thoughts you might have!


Jimmy
I'm pretty much in the same boat Jimmy. I ordered the Max with max Ram and 2TB Storage.

I'm thinking after reading that article that the Echo Dual NVMe Thunderbolt Dock is what I'm going to go with. I have 1 NVME drive that needs a home.

For vision I went with the BlackMagic Mini Monitor 3G as it has a TB port and it's cheap. I also have a brand new BlacMagic Mini Monitor PCIe card that I will try and sell with the Cheesegrater.

As for my 1001 SATA & SSD disks floating around in the studio I was thinking of the Startech 4-Bay Hard Drive Docking Station for 2.5”/3.5” SSDs and HDDs

I'm also running Native.

Something to note. The studio I've been at for the last 5 weeks have been having MASSIVE issues with thye OWC PCIe cards with RAID so personally I'm going to avoid both RAID and OWC. OWC is a good one to avoid cause they are so expensive.
__________________
Re-Recording Mixer/Sound Designer
Sydney Australia
----------------------------------------
OS Monterey
ProTools Ultimate 2022.4
Presonus Quantum 4848
Mac Studio M1 10 Core, 64gig RAM
Sonnet Echo dual NVMe TB Dock
Blackmagic Decklink 3G
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 05-12-2022, 08:36 AM
smurfyou smurfyou is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 1,689
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

Quote:
Originally Posted by kings79 View Post
Something to note. The studio I've been at for the last 5 weeks have been having MASSIVE issues with thye OWC PCIe cards with RAID so personally I'm going to avoid both RAID and OWC. OWC is a good one to avoid cause they are so expensive.
Nothing wrong with OWC for the most part. Tons of happy users and they provide good solutions. Occasional dud product and some design flaws like the Mercury Elite enclosures with loud always-on fans. I've been able to return items I wasn't happy with and then also buy refurbished items others have returned.

I have a more controversial opinion on RAID. It's entirely unnecessary for 90% of users. The speed issues it was designed for no longer exist. And mirroring is no replacement for backup. The only config that makes sense is 10 (1+0) which provides speed and maintains downtime protection say in the middle of a film mix. But then you're at an economic loss using up 4 drives. And for the most part reputable SSD's aren't going to crap out like an overworked spinner. So for me it only makes sense for facilities needing that security with IT to handle it.

Some of the OWC products rely on SoftRAID which I'm not a fan of either.

Some heavy orchestral VI users swear by RAID. In my experience it speeds up initial load time but I'm not a heavy user.
__________________
~Will
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 05-12-2022, 04:39 PM
Eric Lambert's Avatar
Eric Lambert Eric Lambert is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 4,580
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

Quote:
Originally Posted by smurfyou View Post
Mercury Elite enclosures with loud always-on fans.
That's odd. We've had about 5 of these in various studios and none had a fan that we could hear. We're using SSD drives though and there's not much heat -- maybe platter drives, which could get hotter, would force the fans to run. In any case, no, we've never had anything like a fan issue.
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 05-12-2022, 05:20 PM
smurfyou smurfyou is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 1,689
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Lambert View Post
That's odd. We've had about 5 of these in various studios and none had a fan that we could hear. We're using SSD drives though and there's not much heat -- maybe platter drives, which could get hotter, would force the fans to run. In any case, no, we've never had anything like a fan issue.
It depends on the enclosure and the generation. But they used cheap fans with no thermostat so they are on constantly.
__________________
~Will
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 05-12-2022, 10:05 PM
Eric Lambert's Avatar
Eric Lambert Eric Lambert is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 4,580
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

Quote:
Originally Posted by smurfyou View Post
It depends on the enclosure and the generation. But they used cheap fans with no thermostat so they are on constantly.
We have the exact model mentioned, purchased multiple times across several years, and none are what I'd call noisy. We can hear it if we get close, but we're only that close temporarily, to access the computer for a hard restart. If I were to receive a noisy one today I'd send it back. They have a good return policy.
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 05-12-2022, 11:13 PM
kings79's Avatar
kings79 kings79 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 278
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

Quote:
Originally Posted by smurfyou View Post
I have a more controversial opinion on RAID. It's entirely unnecessary for 90% of users. The speed issues it was designed for no longer exist. And mirroring is no replacement for backup. The only config that makes sense is 10 (1+0) which provides speed and maintains downtime protection say in the middle of a film mix. But then you're at an economic loss using up 4 drives. And for the most part reputable SSD's aren't going to crap out like an overworked spinner. So for me it only makes sense for facilities needing that security with IT to handle it.

Some of the OWC products rely on SoftRAID which I'm not a fan of either.

Some heavy orchestral VI users swear by RAID. In my experience it speeds up initial load time but I'm not a heavy user.
I agree. All that speed for no net gain.

ALso, I ordered the Sonnet Dual NVME TB Dock
__________________
Re-Recording Mixer/Sound Designer
Sydney Australia
----------------------------------------
OS Monterey
ProTools Ultimate 2022.4
Presonus Quantum 4848
Mac Studio M1 10 Core, 64gig RAM
Sonnet Echo dual NVMe TB Dock
Blackmagic Decklink 3G
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 05-13-2022, 01:01 AM
Darryl Ramm Darryl Ramm is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 19,510
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

A reminder, as I've posted about on DUC before, that the Echo Dual NVMe Thunderbolt is a simple/dumb enclosure that takes the 4 x PCIE 3 lanes from Thunderbolt and routes two pairs of the lanes to each NVMe M.2 slot

Meaning that each M.2 card can at most can only get up to get half the maximum bandwidth available on a Thunderbolt 3 connection--even if the M.2 card in the other M.2 slot is idle, or not even installed. You can stripe the M.2 drives togetehr with software RAID and hope to regain much of that bandwidth, but I'm no fan of RAID, for reasons others point out above and more.

But at least the Sonnet box has a cooling fan, and the cooling is supposed to be pretty well designed. I've not played with one.

The way to do this "properly" if you want maximum performance and flexibility is to use an enclosure with a PCIe switch, unfortunately they don't exist, at least today, not with just M.2 slots--but you can "build your own" with a Thunderbolt PCIe expansion chassis. Like say a Sonnet Express SE III with up to three PCIe to M.2 slot adapter installed in it. At the other extreme single M.2 card to Thunderbolt enclosures give lots of Thunderbolt connection bandwidth, but lack forced cooling, etc. and the cabling and reliability all potentially have issues if you have a rats nest of connections there. I hope vendors start better designing M.2 storage enclosure for Studio class machines with lots of Thunderbolt busses, I could think of some very nice designs and capabilities.
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 05-13-2022, 11:15 AM
Eric Lambert's Avatar
Eric Lambert Eric Lambert is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 4,580
Default Re: Apple Studio/Mini - What bits we need

Is anyone really using that much bandwidth in-session? I'm fully onboard with having as much as feasibly possible, and some to spare for peace-of-mind, but within reason of practicality. Some of these numbers make me think that people are looking to edit 8K video.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New Apple Mac mini? 7usainarab Pro Tools 2019 52 06-07-2019 06:37 PM
FS: Apple Mac mini 2012 quad i7 2.6 in Sonnet XMAC MINI SERVER rack Jamie Mac Buy & Sell 1 07-02-2017 11:50 AM
Moving from 32 bits to 64 bits Win7 pcmusicpro Windows 1 07-07-2012 08:02 AM
New Apple Mac Mini Server dr sound Post - Surround - Video 2 10-21-2009 02:34 PM
Apple Mini's ?? how are they with pro tools? AcceptingSilence 003, Mbox 2, Digi 002, original Mbox, Digi 001 (Mac) 0 10-14-2005 09:56 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:46 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. Forum Hosted By: URLJet.com