Could someone explain “Tick and sample base”

[andre67]

1) Could someone explain “Tick and sample base” selection to me in detail please. I thought I knew the difference between the two however I discovered that there is a new menu in PTS 7.3 where by, by default the Tick base option is selected, as one opens up new track(s) it default all tracks to tick base. This should not be different from PTS 7.1 to the new PTS 7.3 I thought. I discovered my timing problems are directly related to the default which selects tick and base tracks. My issues are if I record in a new or old session (Old meaning session from PTS 7.1) the first track(s) most of the time are in time with the click, track added in real time would record in time correctly however playing back the track(s) would be played out of time. I didn’t have this issue with PTS 7.1 this is why I did not think my problem with the timing would be related to tick base option, or even think this to be the cause.

2) I have discovered that my Digi002 have a limitation with the Adat a maximum sample rate of only up to 48khz. I was very disappointed with this limitation. I am using the Focusrite Octopre Pre-Amp for additional 8 XLR’s with phantom.

[filosofem]

With respect, Sample/Tick-Base Timing is covered in the Reference Guide.








filosofem

[lemix]

2) I have discovered that my Digi002 have a limitation with the Adat a maximum sample rate of only up to 48khz. I was very disappointed with this limitation. I am using the Focusrite Octopre Pre-Amp for additional 8 XLR’s with phantom.

>> A quick pre-purchase glance at the specifications would have saved you from that "disappointed" feeling. None of the Digidesign hardware supports sample transmission rates higher than 48 kHz via the optical ports.

happy tooling,

[spkguitar]

None of the Digidesign hardware supports sample transmission rates higher than 48 kHz via the optical ports.

I would like to add an addendum/clarification to that ( ); nothing with a standard ADAT lightpipe interface supports sample transmission rates higher than 48 kHz via the optical ports. It's a limitation of the format itself, not necessarily the Digidesign hardware.


The only way higher sample rates can be carried over lightpipe is by a duplexing technology called S/MUX, in which each channel of the lightpipe is paired with another to produce 96kHz (2 x 48 = 96). Since this technology uses two channels of the lightpipe for one full channel of audio, it reduces the track capacity of the format from 8 to 4.

There is no Digidesign LE hardware that is capable of S/MUX.

There are some M-audio units that are compatible with Pro Tools MPowered that are.

[andre67]

I had a looked at the manual again and I said please explain tick and sample base in detail. The manual do not cover in detail!!!!

[spkguitar]

I copied this here from the Reference Manual hoping to get your feedback on exactly what it is that you are having a hard time understanding. Hopefully you can point that out to us. I think it is a pretty straight-forward and detailed explanation of the differences, but maybe you have a different problem that I'm just not perceiving.

Tick- and Sample-Based
Timebases

Pro Tools lets you set any track timebase to either
sample-based or tick-based.
Audio in Pro Tools is sample-based by default.
This means that if an audio region is located at a
particular sample location, it will not move
from that location if the tempo changes in the
session—though its bar and beat location will
change.
MIDI data in Pro Tools is tick-based by default.
This means that if a MIDI region is located at a
particular bar and beat location, it will not move
from that location if the tempo changes in the
session—though its sample location will
change.


Sample-Based Audio and MIDI

If you make an audio track sample-based, all audio
regions in the track have an absolute location
on the timeline. Audio stays fixed to the
sample time, regardless of where tempo or meter
changes occur in a session.
If you make a MIDI track sample-based, all MIDI
events in the track have an absolute location on
the timeline. MIDI events stay fixed to the sample
time, regardless of where tempo or meter
changes occur in a session.


Tick-Based Audio and MIDI

Tick-based audio is fixed to Bars|Beats, and
moves relative to the sample timeline when
tempo and meter changes occur. However,
MIDI events and tick-based audio respond differently
to tempo changes in respect to duration.
MIDI note events change length when
tempo or meter is adjusted, while audio regions
do not. Meter and tempo changes affect only
the start point (or sync point) for each audio region
in a tick-based track.

You can select whether a track is sample-based
or tick-based when you create it, or change timebases
later.

(P.S. this is from the 7.1 manual because it appears that Digi have put security locks in to the new Ref Guide so that we can't copy out of it. Pity. It is, however, the same information as in the 7.3 guide.)

[filosofem]

Shawn, that was exactly what I wanted to know, what specifically did he/her want to know. Personally, the definition given by the Reference Guide is comprehensive and straight forward.








filosofem

[andre67]

Well I had to go this long route to make my point with the timing issue that does not work as it should. Other wise I would have had all sorts of funny quotes from people here as to for example it is pilot error ECT….. I think we all could do without the smart ass remarks and let’s assist one another. Now the manual in this regard in PTS 7.3 has not change as you so quoted and explained here “tick base is related to midi and sample base are related to audio. The one thing both has on common is taken from your quote is “it will not move out of time just and only tempo change “ONLY”.
from that location if the tempo changes” (audio) “it will not move
from that location if the tempo changes (midi). Do you see my point? By default tick base now in PTS 7.3 is ticked in preference menu under edit, however not just the audio but midi too is effect in regards which is playing out of time in PTS 7.3.

Because there is people (one then) that shoot his mouth off before he has the facts.

[filosofem]

I think we all could do without the smart ass remarks

As I said, respectfully, the topic can be covered in the Reference Guide and a more specific question needed to be asked.

If you take this as being a smart ass remark ...so be it!

Bye!









filosofem

[Kris75]

What would the purpose be of using tick based timing on an audio track? Maybe if it was a click track, or a track with a ton of regions that needed to follow the bars and beats, but you should be using tick based for midi and instrument tracks, and sample based for audio tracks, at least In My Opinion. You should be prompted when you create new tracks what you want them to be, Tick or Sample, or you can do it on the strip itself. Are you using a template to open sessions, one that maybe you made by making all the tracks tick based? Are you changing your tempo ever? I ask because I am about to go to 7.3, and am curious about this "bug", but in all honesty, if SPK says its good, it probably is perfect, or near perfect.
It's time to go to 7.3