Physical connections between MTRX Studio & Carbon Pre’s

[markjh10@icloud.com]

Hello,

Please pardon this newbie question but I’d like to know what are the required physical data connections (not audio) between a new MTRX Studio & two new Carbon Pre’s, if any. I want to make sure the MTRX “sees” the two Carbon Pre’s.

Here is my studio’s infrastructure so far:
- Mac Studio M2 Ultra (76-core GPU, 192 GB RAM, 8 TB internal SSD, 8 TB external Thunderbolt 3 SSD, 32 TB SSD inside Sonnet M.2 8x4 Silent Gen4 PCIe card (connected inside a Sonnet ECHO IIII Thunderbolt 3 module), 40 TB external Thunderbolt 3 HDD).
- One Avid HDX PCIe card plugged into a Sonnet ECHO III Thunderbolt 3 module inside a Sonnet xMac Studio enclosure; HDX card connected to MTRX Studio via two Avid DigiLink cables, one per each port.
- One Avid Pro Tools | MTRX Studio interface connected to both ports on Avid HDX cards.
- Two Avid Pro Tools | Carbon Pre pre-amps connected to MTRX Studio with audio ins & outs using DB-25 cables between MTRX Studio & Carbon Pre’s.
- iConnectivity mioXL 8x12 MIDI interface/MIDI patch bay.
- DAW: Avid Pro Tools Ultimate Perpetual License

Steps completed so far:
- Installed Avid HD driver successfully
- Installed Avid HDX card testing application successfully

The Mac Studio sees the HDX card and passes all tests with Avid’s HDX card test software. I’ve not updated any firmware on any Avid hardware yet, nor installed DADMan nor installed Pro Tools Ultimate yet, as I want to install Pro Tools after I know all hardware is connected & configured correctly to make troubleshooting easier.

My concern is how my Apple Mac Studio & Avid MTRX Studio will connect to the Carbon Pre pre-amps. I’ve got a feeling there’s something missing somehow.
I think I’m good with the audio DB-25 connections between interface & pre-amps but I think I’m missing a data connection between the MTRX Studio & Carbon Pre’s.

I’d appreciate any advice on next steps. Thanks in advance to anyone who replies.

[Darryl Ramm]

You keep talking about a "concern" what exactly are you worried about? You want to use EUCON to control the preamps? Hoping for DADman integration? And what do you mean exactly by MTRX "sees" the Carbon Pre?

Why are you not connecting the Carbon pres to the MTRX Studio via ADAT? Seems a waste to go out via analog, regardless of how good convertors are. And then nothign has to "see" nothing you just drive ADAT into the MTRX ADAT ports, the ADAT receiving box does not care and cannot tell what is sending it data. Neither does anything care if you go analog. It will just work.

Hopefully the Carbon Pre is just exposed as Eucon from one of it's Ethernet ports, and this will just work via EUCON, but I have no idea. What is for sure is there is no integration with the the whole DADman world in which the MTRX Studio lives (different companies/competing product teams).

[markjh10@icloud.com]

Darryl,

Thanks for your reply and sorry if I wasn’t clear enough in my posted question.

The “issue” for me is that once I install Pro Tools Ultimate, I want the DAW to recognize both the MTRX Studio & both Carbon Pre’s. Obviously, if I haven’t got all required physical connections correct, Pro Tools won’t record or playback through my audio infrastructure correctly. I also want to make configuration & troubleshooting easier by getting all physical hardware correctly communicating ahead of the Pro Tools install. In other words, I want to get the physical connections correct first to eliminate any of those issues prior to configuring logical routing in software.

As I stated at the start of my post, I’m a newbie to digital audio networking (but not to IT networking in general), coming from an all-analog world. I’m intensely catching up on ADAT, Dante, DADMan & EUCON. Asking questions on this forum is only one part of my playing “catch-up”.

One common port type between MTRX Studio & Carbon Pre is ADAT, which you’ve mentioned. Is connecting the MTRX Studio to the Carbon Pre’s via fiber optic cables the answer I’m looking for?

[Darryl Ramm]

I don't know what the answer you are looking for is because you are not cleanly articulating what it is you are worried about working or not. You want the DAW to recognize the Pre? That might make sense if you wanted pre remote control? Pro Tools and the MTRX Studio will work fine with the Carbon Pre or any other analog of ADAT preamp ever built that you connect to the MTRX Studio, Pro Tools does does not need to be aware of anything to do with it. You, the wetware, made it work by,... wait for it... connecting the preamp outputs to the correct inputs on the interface. Just like in any analog setup you have experience with. Pro Tools does not need to "see" anything in the Carbon Pre for this setup to work/be usable.

At a minimum the Carbon Pre are stand-alone preamps, with analog or ADAT output. I'd use ADAT. You connect TOSLINK cables from the ADAT output(s) of the Carbon Pre to the ADAT Inputs(s) of the MTRX Studio as I already suggested above. Connect a wordclock cable going the other way if you want the MTRX Studio to be the clock source. Nothing more needed, this will work if connected and configured properly. You control the Pre from their front panel. ADAT and Wordclock are explained in hundreds of articles and posts online, and on DUC, and in the product documentation.

If you want remote control of the Pre from Pro Tools and Eucon you get that over Ethernet between the Pre and your computer. That's all described in the Carbon systems documentation. You *need* to read that. But start by just getting the Pre connected and working as a dumb preamp.

There is no specific management link or intelligence happening between the MTRX Studio (and say DADman) and the Carbon Pre, again different products from different competing companies/teams. And Dadman is all DAD/NTP not Avid technology. But you do get to manage those ADAT inputs in the MTRX Studio via DADman since that is the DADman side of this picture. But even with competing products, the Carbon folks described all you need to know about using the Carbon Pre remote control with a MTRX or MTRX Studio (or any other interface) in the Carbon Systems documentation.

Stop worrying about stuff in the abstract and stop loading yourself down with worrying about things you can't even describe you need. Start just getting stuff working, get audio working, without remote control or EUCON stuff (do read the doc however). You will discover what works or not when you try to do stuff, and usually a whole faster learning experience, you are not going to destroy or harm anything by actually doing and learning this stuff. If that won't work for you now is the time to bring in a consultant and they can discuss what you are trying to do and set all this up turnkey for you.

And for many of us remote control mic preamps are more a PITA than they are worth, but that's your decision (they can be fantastic in some studio setups).

[smurfyou]

Yeah you're using two separate product groups. The Carbon Pre's will just be ADAT connected mic pres for you. They don't "integrate" with MTRX Studio or DADMan or HDX.

^Eucontrol as Darryl suggests is about it.

[markjh10@icloud.com]

Thanks to Darryl & Will for their replies. In moving from consumer-oriented audio hardware to industry-standard advanced professional gear, I also have to change my mindset as well and rely on new learning & concepts rather than past experience. I appreciate this forum in helping this mid-1980’s MIDI pioneer move into 21st-century recording.