Sonarworks Reference problem

[Danny_79]

Originally Posted by albee1952

You'll need to figure out what works best for you. That's why the options are there Here's my 2 cents:
Flat target?-that depends on what you want to hear, and what your room/spkrs can deliver. And, "flat" to what extreme? If you have small speakers, its likely a waste of time to shoot for flat to 40Hz

Latency-This one is pretty simple. If you are not self-recording(recording while listening to the main output), then latency probably doesn't matter. If the latency bothers you, then you would have good reason to bypass(you really only need the reference curve while mixing, anyway).

The rest are up to you, but keep this in mind: If the reference curve has a lot of boost, that boost will chew up headroom(of your speakers) really fast. Keep a keen ear out for breakup in the low end(likely where most of the "magic" is happening. Lately, I have been using IK Multimedia ARC3 instead(not sure its any better, its just easier for me) and the plugin always defaults to -12 on the output(probably to save some headroom). Since my speakers can deliver maybe 105db, I'm fine with things being turned down, but I usually reset the output to -0 as my normal mixing level is rarely above the lower 90db range. If I do crank it up, its only for a few seconds to hear if anything(mix-wise) falls apart

And always remember to bypass the plugin when bouncing a mix. I may have said that already, but I do work for the department of redundancy department........

Cheers for the input! But i am unsure of what "flat target" means in this case. Is it that the plugin aims for a flat sound? My speakers ranges between 57 hz to 21 khz. I am also not quite sure what "listening spot" does. The others i got a pretty good idea about, i think:)

[Bob L]

"Flat Target" refers to no (or minimal) deviation in frequency response from an ideal by the playback system. The idea is that if you have flat response in your listening environment, theoretically you shouldn't hear the signal differently on any other "flat" system. "Theoretically". In real life, part of a mixer's job is to interpret how their mix translates to other systems (which are never flat).

Listening Spot correction includes phase delay between speakers that is established during the calibration phase of setting up the correction curve. If you calibrate for a specific position in your mix environment, usually the position of your ears, there will be differences in phase and relative levels between the speakers if you position yourself differently during mix. For example, if you move your chair back a foot from your calibrated position there is going to be a different phase relationship, as the distance from each speaker to your ears has changed. Can it be noticeable? Sure. Can it be minor? Sure. Will it be a showstopper? Probably not, if it's only a foot. If you move to another position in the room, say off-axis, it will absolutely be different, but you probably aren't making mix decisions from that listening position except when you sanity-check your mix from the next room, etc.

I'll admit that I was surprised how much corrected phase relationship altered the monitoring when I first setup Reference 4.

FWIW, I bought Sonarworks' reference mic, for which they have plotted the inherent non-linearity of the individual microphone. They include a serial number for each mic that associates the mic's own correction curve, so that when you calibrate your system, you enter the serial of the mic into the software which applies the mic's correction curve before the calibration. Note that I'm on Reference 4 and staying there.

[Danny_79]

Originally Posted by Bob L

"Flat Target" refers to no (or minimal) deviation in frequency response from an ideal by the playback system. The idea is that if you have flat response in your listening environment, theoretically you shouldn't hear the signal differently on any other "flat" system. "Theoretically". In real life, part of a mixer's job is to interpret how their mix translates to other systems (which are never flat).

Listening Spot correction includes phase delay between speakers that is established during the calibration phase of setting up the correction curve. If you calibrate for a specific position in your mix environment, usually the position of your ears, there will be differences in phase and relative levels between the speakers if you position yourself differently during mix. For example, if you move your chair back a foot from your calibrated position there is going to be a different phase relationship, as the distance from each speaker to your ears has changed. Can it be noticeable? Sure. Can it be minor? Sure. Will it be a showstopper? Probably not, if it's only a foot. If you move to another position in the room, say off-axis, it will absolutely be different, but you probably aren't making mix decisions from that listening position except when you sanity-check your mix from the next room, etc.

I'll admit that I was surprised how much corrected phase relationship altered the monitoring when I first setup Reference 4.

FWIW, I bought Sonarworks' reference mic, for which they have plotted the inherent non-linearity of the individual microphone. They include a serial number for each mic that associates the mic's own correction curve, so that when you calibrate your system, you enter the serial of the mic into the software which applies the mic's correction curve before the calibration. Note that I'm on Reference 4 and staying there.

Thanx dude...think i understand enough now.

[bchrismar]

Bumping an oldie here...

I just bought SoundID and calibrated my room for the first time. All went well, imported my profile into PT and I like what it's done for the room EQ wise. Definitely cleaned up.

But the volume level is very low. Even when I compensate by turning it up to -0... there appears to be a -7.9db reduction on all outputs. (L/R/C/LFE/LS/RS)

This means cranking my monitor level way up near max on my Focusrite Clarett.

(Using a session around -23LKFS as reference, attempting to test listening levels)

What am I missing? This can't be how it's intended. I'm a noob to the software so it's probably me...?

[Sardi]

Originally Posted by bchrismar

Bumping an oldie here...

I just bought SoundID and calibrated my room for the first time. All went well, imported my profile into PT and I like what it's done for the room EQ wise. Definitely cleaned up.

But the volume level is very low. Even when I compensate by turning it up to -0... there appears to be a -7.9db reduction on all outputs. (L/R/C/LFE/LS/RS)

This means cranking my monitor level way up near max on my Focusrite Clarett.

(Using a session around -23LKFS as reference, attempting to test listening levels)

What am I missing? This can't be how it's intended. I'm a noob to the software so it's probably me...?

How much boost is in the correction? This would account for the reduction in volume.

If you’re room is bad with drastic peaks/nulls, the software is going to have to make drastic cuts/boosts to fix the problems. If it doesn’t lower the output, then you’re going to be clipping.

My Sonarworks correction is pretty tame in a couple of specific spots, but my monitoring placement and room treatment is about as good as can get for my space, so the software doesn’t have to do that much. Even still, the output is still lowered. But, at 50% amplification, its already very loud.


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[massivekerry]

Originally Posted by bchrismar

Bumping an oldie here...

I just bought SoundID and calibrated my room for the first time. All went well, imported my profile into PT and I like what it's done for the room EQ wise. Definitely cleaned up.

But the volume level is very low. Even when I compensate by turning it up to -0... there appears to be a -7.9db reduction on all outputs. (L/R/C/LFE/LS/RS)

This means cranking my monitor level way up near max on my Focusrite Clarett.

(Using a session around -23LKFS as reference, attempting to test listening levels)

What am I missing? This can't be how it's intended. I'm a noob to the software so it's probably me...?

What Sardi says.

But also, -23 LKFS, plus the “Safe mode” output reduction on Sound ID is pretty low, period. This is partly why I run 2 Master Outputs - one at my desired level to bounce, without Sound ID, and a “Monitor” Output that I actually listen to, that is turned up, and then has the Sound ID Reference plug-in on it.

[bchrismar]

Excellent input y'all, thank you so much.

[bchrismar]

OK one more and this is possibly super-dumb so go easy on me...

The SoundID calibration is for a room profile only, correct? (EQ correction on playback, time-correction/phase correction etc.). This tool is completely separate from general speaker calibration, correct? In other words, doing SPL readings at setting your sparkers all to (79 db etc) is do be done before hand - then run the SoundID after that? But, during the process it has you changing volume levels on specific speakers for better readings, which would throw off the (already completed) SPL calibration, no?

Make it make sense please. Thanks!

[Bob L]

You are over-thinking this.

Take your best shot at treating your physical environment; absorption, diffusion, etc.

Calibrate your monitoring with Sound ID. Positive EQ corrections will reduce the output level(s) as previously noted. In my case, I had a stupid bad null around 100 Hz, so Reference 4 (current version at the time) indicated a stupid high EQ node to compensate the null which resulted in a stupid low output level being required to compensate for the stupid high correction without clipping the output.

Compensating the compensation is as easy as turning up the big knob on my Big Knob.

If you want/need/require 79dB as your monitoring level, adjust whatever substitutes for the Big Knob on your rig to that level.

TL,DR;
Treat.
Calibrate.
Adjust monitor level.

Done. Dusted. Bob's your uncle. Wait... Am I your uncle? I think not.