Metering??

[ThomasPMusic]

Is there a way to get to see a "digital" meter mode where we could see a metering based on "zero-is-full-scale"?
I am used to policing gain in the digital world, and knowing that when I soundcheck a drummer, I just let him hit -8db or so and we're good for the whole show. But the venue is sort of in its own world. I even get a channel meter thats red and it still has 4 or 5db before clip in protools. I would like to see a more "digital" interaction as an option. When I see +15db as a level, thats +15db in relation to what? Where is "full scale"? And, is the protools HD split "padded down" gain-wise or do I really have room even when the channel is red?

I have set the clip margin to 1db in the setup panel, but could we ever get a real digital metering as an option in, say, d-show 3.0:)

Also, as a software idea, could I (some day be able to) send a direct out thru a plug-in, and then on to its destination?
Kind of like an "insert" on a direct out.
So, in a plug-in, the input would be "direct xx", and its output would be "stage xx"
I'd like an eq and/or dynamics for my aviom feeds that would be separate from my house eq's.
Its just a routing thing, is it hard to do?
Not a software guy here, just a dreaming mix engineer...

tp

[StrobeAlific]

Just treat "0" on the VU as -15 in the digital realm.

As far as plugins on a direct out...
How many channels are you using? You can configure the console to do "64" channels if you have 48 pres, then double patch what you are sending to Aviom or whatever. Then you can eq and assign plugins and direct out to your aviom without sending it to your main mix.

[ThomasPMusic]

I have a template that does just that.
I double-patch the things that need independant eq.
I have an aviom kick and a regular kick, and so on....
Depending on the size of the production, I sometimes need the 96 channel engine, which gobbles up too many chips.
There is a work-around, just asking how/if we could ever see something like this in the software

[StrobeAlific]

Max out to 5 mix engine cards and get a 2nd venue system with 96 pres like we did.

I'm guessing you don't have a separate monitor position?

[Sheldon Radford]

Hi Thomas,

Is there a way to get to see a "digital" meter mode where we could see a metering based on "zero-is-full-scale"?

We chose an analog style meter scale - with a 0 dB reference and some amount of headroom above - in order to make VENUE consoles feel more like an an analog console in terms of gain structure and summing/metering. The meters go to +15 dB, and there's another 5 dB of headroom above this before you hit the max (0 dBFS).

To set inputs in for a -8 dBFS reference simply set the clip threshold (Options>Interaction page) to 8 dB below max. When you see the meter LEDs turn red you know you're there. Alternately, you can use a plug-in such as TrooTrace and use its built-in meter, which uses a 0 dBFS ref. If you do this I suggest routing the monitor bus to the plug-in, so that anything you solo will automatically show up on the meters. Don't forget to set the monitoring control (on the console) to its full clockwise 0 dB position in order to preserve unity gain.

When I see +15db as a level, thats +15db in relation to what? Where is "full scale"?

0 dB on VENUE's meters = -20 dBFS
+20 dB on VENUE (which is 5 dB beyond the meter scale) = 0 dBFS
If you set the input clip threshold to 0 dB below max, when you see red on the input meters the Pro Tools send is likely also clipped.

And, is the protools HD split "padded down" gain-wise or do I really have room even when the channel is red?

The Pro Tools feed is not padded down or attenuated in any way, it's simply a matter of different reference scales. The clip threshold settings determines how much margin you have when the console meters show red. For example, using the default 6 dB setting the meters go red 6 dB below full scale, both within the console and on the Pro Tools feed (assuming a top of channel pickoff).

Also, as a software idea, could I (some day be able to) send a direct out thru a plug-in, and then on to its destination?

Sure - it's possible to do this with today's version. Simply choose the Directs option from the plug-in pulldown routing menu, instead of Insert or Bus. That one's easy.

Sheldon

[ThomasPMusic]

Sheldon,

I can assign the input of a plugin to a direct (or from a direct as it would be), but I want that plugin output to be the stage rack (or any "physical output" rather than a new channel.

So, I could take the direct of my kick drum from top of channel, and send that direct out thru an eq plugin and then on to the stage out where my aviom is without going thru another mixer channel...
The input side of the plugin is ready for this, like when I want to feed the main Lead vocal thru its own reverb and then on to an fx return, for example...
It still seems that a tweak in available output choices would give great flexibility here. We do plan to max the processing cards and have already investigated the cost of getting a second stage rack.

BTW, can we get a second stage rack that is only partially populated with input cards?
I only see 48 input stage racks at most venue dealers.
We would need like 16 extra inputs, and then could pop in cards and grow later on too...
tp

[Sheldon Radford]

Hi Thomas,

I can assign the input of a plugin to a direct (or from a direct as it would be), but I want that plugin output to be the stage rack (or any "physical output" rather than a new channel....It still seems that a tweak in available output choices would give great flexibility here.

It's possible do this today with the routing choices provided. Any plug-in being fed by a Direct Out or a bus can be returned to console channel or be routed directly to any physical output, including stage outputs. The routing choices appear in the output pull down menu.

BTW, can we get a second stage rack that is only partially populated with input cards?
I only see 48 input stage racks at most venue dealers.

Yes, there's an option to buy an empty stage rack and populate it as desired. Your VENUE dealer should be able to assist with this as it's a standard item on all price lists.

Sheldon

[StrobeAlific]

Sheldon,

That's information I've never had before about Venue...You have some great descriptions and explanations of stuff and even told me some stuff I should have known but didn't really think about it in that way.

Thanks for all your input.

[dstagl]

Digi, you guys should have Robert Scovill do a video on creative routing uses in Venue because I know he's opened my eyes to some things I hadn't thought of before.

Dave

[ThomasPMusic]

Sheldon,

I checked, and the routing option is available when you double click the plugin, its available in the top menu-bar pulldowns.
It is not available from within the plugin rack using the arrows.
When you selectg a direct as input, you get only channels and FX returns as outputs until you "open" the plugin, then there are more choices in the larger pulldowns.
tp