SMPTE Question

[paulsanka]

Hi,

I'm doing the sound design/editing on a documentary in the next month and I need some advice regarding synchronization with Pro Tools LE. I've never used LE before, just DSP, so I'm not familiar with the synchronization options in LE.

Usually, I work with Logic Platinum on a G4 desktop system in my studio synched up to a timecode VCR through a MOTU Midi Express USB. This time however, because of a very tight post-production schedule, I'm going to be editing the sound away from my studio on an iBook G4.

I was planning on buying an MBox for the iBook and using ProTools LE to cut the sound but I was reading on the forums that I have to buy the DV Toolkit (for $1000 USD) to display a SMPTE Ruler and run a session at 29.97!? Is this true?

Will I be able to slave ProTools LE to my VHS deck through my Midi Express USB and run the session in 29.97 or is the DV ToolKit required for this? Does anyone have any advice on what I should do?

Thanks,

ps

[Thresholdproductions]

I think you will need the DV toolkit as well as an MTPAV for accurate synchro to VHS. The Midi express doesn't have the synchro you need to hook up to your VHS machine. Why not digitize your VHS material to quicktime and then synch to the timecode burn. That would help.

John

[antiphase]

why do u even need timecode........ I don't even use the crap anymore. I did an hour documentary project on LE and FCP HD without the need of timecode. But if you must use it............. I would not use PTLE........ 1000 for a simple time ruler???? ahhaha....... go get another copy of logic pro and give it to me. I would stay with Logic if i were u. 1000 bucks for the DV toolkit is beyond stupid.

[katoramone]

I've done 2 broadcast animations on LE by simply dumping the video to quicktime with timecode burn on it. If your session is setup right it wont stray on the timeline.

[steppenwolf68]

Exactly, you usually capture video to quicktime with burnt-in Timecode. If you get yourself an Canopus ADVC 100 you can output the quicktime to an external video monitor (quicktime has to be encoded with the DV codec) this way your cpu is released off the video decoding . If you need a timecode ruler in PT without wanting to buy DV Toolkit you can do the following: find someone with a PT TDM rig and let him save an empty session with Timecode displayed in both rulers. Now bring that session to your system, open it and you will have Timecode dsiplayed in the sub ruler. But beware:
once you've changed the sub ruler let's say to bars&beats you cannot go back to Timecode (simply don't alter the sub ruler).

Hope this helps.

steppenwolf

[paulsanka]

Thanks for all the advice everyone.

Perhaps someone could walk me through digitizing my reels to QT. I kind of like that idea because then I could ditch the extra hassle of carting around my VCR and MOTU. So I have the Canopus ADVC-100 and the lab will be sending me the transfer of the 1st answer print on Beta SP–is it necessary to get them to burn the TC right into the tapes?

What's the process from this point on?

A couple of other questions:

1) Someone said I can still output the QT video to an external monitor. How do I do this, is this from ProTools?

2) Having someone save me a session with the TC ruler from a TDM system seems like an easy enough workaround. Any other things I'm missing with the DV toolkit?

3) If I decide to go with Logic Pro instead, can I digitize to QT and output to an external montior in Logic too?

Thanks for all the help,

ps

[Lanois WannaB]

I don't know if Digi allows LE users to do this or if it is a bug they have not fixed yet. I have several TDM sessions saved as stationary pad w/ different frame rates that I use for all my post work in LE. I will be very upset if Digi fixes this "bug" in the next update. Because I agree, $1000 for what DV Toolkit gives you is a little overboard.

[K-Man]

Thanks for all the advice everyone.

Perhaps someone could walk me through digitizing my reels to QT. I kind of like that idea because then I could ditch the extra hassle of carting around my VCR and MOTU. So I have the Canopus ADVC-100 and the lab will be sending me the transfer of the 1st answer print on Beta SP–is it necessary to get them to burn the TC right into the tapes?

What's the process from this point on?

A couple of other questions:

1) Someone said I can still output the QT video to an external monitor. How do I do this, is this from ProTools?

2) Having someone save me a session with the TC ruler from a TDM system seems like an easy enough workaround. Any other things I'm missing with the DV toolkit?

3) If I decide to go with Logic Pro instead, can I digitize to QT and output to an external montior in Logic too?

Thanks for all the help,

ps



Timecode is a nice thing to have burned into the video. It helps you a lot syncing the picture to your ruler. Especially if you're using a TDM template with timecode on an LE system.

As far as using the Canopus ADVC-100, I think that you'll at least need the Avid Mojo to work with that properly. Don't quote me entirely on that though. The house I post at uses TDM systems that firewire's its video out to a AV Option XL then to the Canopus ADVC-100. I believe that is the proper signal path. But I've never had to worry about setting it up. So don't quote me on that.

To answer #1.) As long as you have a second monitor connected to your systems for dual screened monitoring (not mirrored monitoring) and you're showing QT videos through nothing but Pro Tools, you should simply be able to "click" your mouse anywhere on the Quicktime video window and it should center itself on your second screen.

#2.) Yes, you can have someone save you a template from a TDM system with Timecode as the subruler and as the grid. It translates over to LE nicely. I do the exact same thing when I'm not planning to work on a TDM system. But, yes, it's a rediculous workaround.

#3.) I don't know.

Just remember... The higher compressed your QT video is, frame accuracy flies right out the window. Even if there's T/C burn on the picture. You won't be frame accurate and bad edits will occur. It is best to have some sort of an active T/C ruler in place. Especially for your record keeping so you can communicate with another post house, or print house properly with what you did in your session. Just because someone says that they don't use T/C anymore doesn't mean they're right. They've probably had some loose sync with their audio to picture and settled with it. They've also failed to mention subframes. They could be cutting sound to the end of a frame when they think it's the beginning.

It's in your best interest to have that timecode ruler and/or grid to have some sort of proper sync. And have your QT video compressed around 10:1. Picture is still pretty sharp to catch everything needed.

Cheers!

[steppenwolf68]

Paul, all you need is the Canopus and a video capturing software like btvpro. Connect the Canopus to your computer via firewire . Then connect the video output of the Beta (make sure it has TC displayed in the picture) to the Canopus Video in (hit the "analog in" button on the Canopus).
Now capture your film using btvpro (make sure it captures using Quicktime DV codec). After saving your quicktime movie hit "digital in" on the Canopus and then open up your PT session. Now you select "import movie" : the movie now shows up in PT. Then connect an external video monitor to the video output of the Canopus. Now select in PT "play dv movie out of firewire" an the movie will show up on your video monitor . Finally spot your quicktime movie to the corresponding timecode position and finally set the movie sync offset in PT to 22 sq.fr. That's it !!!

By th way: you cannot scrub lipsync to picture using this solution...

Hope this helps...

steppenwolf