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  #1  
Old 02-10-2011, 01:24 AM
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Default *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

I have now confirmed this in both V7 and V8 on both Mac and PC. This occurs in the IDR plugin, L1+, L2, L3, and probably any other Waves plugin that offers the IDR dither.

Switching through the dither types can cause random dithering results as seen on a bitscope. If anyone wants to see this, bring up L1+ and put it on 8-bit so that you can see this on any meter. Switch through the types and you'll find type 2 gives random results with noise-shaping on and you'll also see random results when switching to "None"(off).

I tried to report this to Waves and the support tech treated me like an idiot.

See a couple of screen shots:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2505899/IDR%20Fault.JPG
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2505899/IDR%20Fault%202.JPG

Better yet, see it for yourself.



Here's my correspondence with Waves word for word with a little redaction. Start at the bottom.

Quote:
-------Answer from Waves at 2/8/2011 4:05:17 AM
Hi James;

I am defiantly up to date regarding what is included in the AudioTrack- let me repeat:

Both the IDR and the DLA are only components which are being installed with ANY Waves Plug-In.

However, they are not Plug-Ins, and therefore I do not understand what the issue that you are having is.

The DLA is a component which improves the delay compensation of the host and cannot even be loaded.

The IDR is related to dithering, but again- it works only in the background.

BTW, I know how to open a link...

Have a great day


If you need further assistance feel free to contact us or visit www.Wavesupport.net

Best Regards,
XXXXXXXXXXXX
Waves Technical Support Staff


-------Question/Reply from XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX at 2/7/2011 3:27:00 PM
XXXXXX,

Thanks for the reply. It seems that you may not be up to date on what came with Audiotrack. I also got the IDR plugin and DLA installed with it. DLA I cannot use since it is a TDM plugin.

The IDR plugin properly dithers at 20 and 16 bit depths as seen on a bitscope. But, it also sometimes adds noise when switched to "no IDR" The linked pic shows the noise on the bitscope. I checked the link and it is good. Since this form doesn''t support hyperlinking, copying and pasting the link in your browser URL will get you to the picture.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2505899/IDR%20Fault.JPG

As for Audiotrack, it seems to be working just fine. I bought it because it is one of very few plugins on the market that can actually do upward expansion. The compressor ratio can go below 1.


-------Answer from Waves at 2/6/2011 6:47:07 AM

Dear James,

All of the Waves products include the IDR component.

However, it is not an actual Plug-In and you can't really use it.

Originally, it was a dithering Plug-In.

BTW, the link you sent me to the screenshot didn't work.

Please let me know if something is wrong with the Audio Track Plug-In.

Have a good one,


If you need further assistance feel free to contact us or visit www.Wavesupport.net

Best Regards,
XXXXXXXXXXXX
Waves Technical Support Staff


-------Question/Reply from XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX at 2/4/2011 2:26:51 PM
I purchased Audiotrack last night from audioMIDI.com. After installing version 8, I found that the IDR plugin was included. I opened IDR and a bit scope to see the dither being added. I found that when switching to "no IDR", there would sometimes be a noise in the 22nd-24th bit level. Sometimes it would be in one channel or the other. Sometimes it would be non-identical in both channels. Here's a link to a pic of the issue.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2505899/IDR%20Fault.JPG

BTW, if this is the second time you see this bug report from me, when i first submitted it, it appeared as though my account login had expired and there's was absolutely no indication that the form data had been successfully submitted.
IDR is a plugin and you can use it.

_
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  #2  
Old 02-11-2011, 11:27 AM
aka21stCentury aka21stCentury is offline
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Default Re: *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

Did Greg Aitken write this? No. Avoid all dithering algorithms unless his name appears as an author.

This cheap deal is just a scam to force users to buy an ilok/use an ilok.

(OT) Laptop users cannot use iLoks w/o hubs & third party chipsets. Soon another nightmare is about to crop up (USB-3 mangled code). It took years for Opcode (who rewrote Apple's USB protocol) and Microsoft (who released buggy USB 1.1 code in their gold master W-2000). They were two years behind Apple (I mean Opcode).

Then AVID releases an mBox Pro 3 at 1394a speeds knowing firewire is like SCSI, the slowest common denominator wins? Designed for Apple's 1394(b) macbooks. Duh? Many do not like to lug around a 17in laptop. They are more likely to be dropped or mishandled (solder balls beneath the chips come loose when case is flexed).

Lightstream is finally coming (optical firewire) please work with the 1394 group here and Intel and get a Pro unit ready (that is stable) for recording off house mixers. 64 channels. How many years now?

It will take years to get the bugs out of USB-3 backwards compatible code and the chipset makers to get 'it' right. Dump iLoks now! IMHO.

(end of OT rant)

Maybe if Dave O. wrote the code (Opcode's founder) I'd think about using it. But unless as above; Greg Aitken or Dave O., forget it. 44.1 or 88.2k... is my solution.

Right on Top Jimmy for scoping this out.
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  #3  
Old 02-11-2011, 12:21 PM
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Default Re: *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

The Man is holding us down..... It's time we revolt... it worked for egypt.












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Old 02-11-2011, 01:02 PM
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Default Re: *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by danander11 View Post
The Man is holding us down..... It's time we revolt... it worked for egypt.




Someone needs to step down! I just dont know who.

Normally people praise Waves support. I find it odd that they would answer in this way.
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  #5  
Old 02-11-2011, 04:14 PM
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Default Re: *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunburst79 View Post
Someone needs to step down! I just dont know who.

Normally people praise Waves support. I find it odd that they would answer in this way.
Yep.. I know I come off as a Waves fanboi sometimes, but they have always been great for me.. and I can ask some pretty dumb questions
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  #6  
Old 02-12-2011, 02:14 AM
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Default Re: *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by aka21stCentury View Post
This cheap deal is just a scam to force users to buy an ilok/use an ilok.
Tin foil hat anyone?
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  #7  
Old 02-12-2011, 11:04 AM
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Default Re: *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by aka21stCentury View Post
This cheap deal is just a scam to force users to buy an ilok/use an ilok.
I disagree.

I think its all about getting them to join the WAVE's ecosystem. Like a drug dealer giving out free samples to the potential customer. Once you need to pay WUP for the first time many folks will spring for a bundle.

Ilok is better than lost Challenge and Response auths.
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  #8  
Old 02-12-2011, 11:19 AM
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Default Re: *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

That's only a problem for the LE crowd. Everyone else (M-Powered, 9, and HD) all have iloks. So as far as PT it's only LE 7 or 8 people that will be forced. Buying an iLok and That audiomidi deal is still cheaper than buying Audiotrack at Waves.
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  #9  
Old 02-12-2011, 11:43 AM
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Default Re: *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

It's amazing how you could spend so much money and they talk to you this way. I can imagine if I bought a high end Benz and a dealership employee used this type of tone with me, I'd probably punch him in his mouth!
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  #10  
Old 02-12-2011, 11:50 AM
necjamc necjamc is offline
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Default Re: *WARNING* Waves IDR whacked!!!!!

Maybe i am missing something, but i can put IDR on an insert as plug for Dither. (Ver 7) Is it not suppose to work that way? Audiotrack is the only waves plug I have.
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