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  #1  
Old 05-08-2009, 03:55 AM
preachers preachers is offline
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Default 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

i uesd elastic audio to timing my multi-track drum this afternoon, and found there were many problem in phasing.

i grouped all the kits together and gave them different algorithm(rhythmic for all the close mic drums and polyphonic for cymbals and space mic). at most time, it was fine, but occasionly there were some phase problems with snare, you can clearly found that, it's cancellation created there when i put a warp marker on it, if i remove the marker, the phase will be ok.

anyone experienced that? how can i solve this?????
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  #2  
Old 05-08-2009, 04:43 AM
woodsdenis woodsdenis is offline
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Default Re: 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by preachers View Post
i uesd elastic audio to timing my multi-track drum this afternoon, and found there were many problem in phasing.

i grouped all the kits together and gave them different algorithm(rhythmic for all the close mic drums and polyphonic for cymbals and space mic). at most time, it was fine, but occasionly there were some phase problems with snare, you can clearly found that, it's cancellation created there when i put a warp marker on it, if i remove the marker, the phase will be ok.

anyone experienced that? how can i solve this?????
You should use rhythmic for all tracks in the group. Polyphonic will stretch audio while rhythmic will act more like recycle/beatdetective. I would say that is your issue, try rhythmic on the group and see what happens.
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  #3  
Old 05-08-2009, 05:14 AM
preachers preachers is offline
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Default Re: 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

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Originally Posted by woodsdenis View Post
You should use rhythmic for all tracks in the group. Polyphonic will stretch audio while rhythmic will act more like recycle/beatdetective. I would say that is your issue, try rhythmic on the group and see what happens.
it won't work by your method, because rhythmic algorithm will add some artifacts to cymbals and space mics.
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Old 05-08-2009, 05:46 AM
tj_davies tj_davies is offline
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Default Re: 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

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Originally Posted by preachers View Post
it won't work by your method, because rhythmic algorithm will add some artifacts to cymbals and space mics.
Try altering the decay rate.
Hope this helps,
Timothy
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  #5  
Old 05-08-2009, 07:41 AM
preachers preachers is offline
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Default Re: 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

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Originally Posted by tj_davies View Post
Try altering the decay rate.
Hope this helps,
Timothy
i had try this function in rhythmic mode, and it dosen't work for get rid off artifacts at all.
in my situation, the phase problem could't be made by wrong decay rate setting.
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  #6  
Old 05-08-2009, 11:12 AM
elicious elicious is offline
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Default Re: 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

did you consolidate your trax first?
e
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  #7  
Old 05-08-2009, 07:58 PM
preachers preachers is offline
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Default Re: 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

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Originally Posted by elicious View Post
did you consolidate your trax first?
e
yes i do
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  #8  
Old 05-09-2009, 03:17 AM
Bryan_Golder Bryan_Golder is offline
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Default Re: 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

Yep, that's the way it is. The different algorithms stretch the audio in different ways. I do the same thing though - I've experimented with using X-Form on the O/H & Room mics and rhythmic on the close mics. Depends on the material. Works sometimes, other times not. Sometimes your best bet is to not use elastic audio and chop it up the old fashioned way. Also, I've found that excess analysis markers on the OH/Room mics (as well as any other instrument with a complex sound) degrade the sound of those tracks. Try deleting most if not all of the analysis markers on the OH/Room mic tracks, then warp all drums grouped together using warp markers only on the close mics, then switch the OH/Rooms to X-Form (and take a nice vacation while it renders). Sometimes that gives pretty good results. Also, try recutting the drums with a better drummer if all else fails. As I get older, I find myself much less tolerant of sloppy drummers and having to Pro Tool the crap out of loose performances.
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  #9  
Old 05-09-2009, 06:30 AM
preachers preachers is offline
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Default Re: 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_Golder View Post
Yep, that's the way it is. The different algorithms stretch the audio in different ways. I do the same thing though - I've experimented with using X-Form on the O/H & Room mics and rhythmic on the close mics. Depends on the material. Works sometimes, other times not. Sometimes your best bet is to not use elastic audio and chop it up the old fashioned way. Also, I've found that excess analysis markers on the OH/Room mics (as well as any other instrument with a complex sound) degrade the sound of those tracks. Try deleting most if not all of the analysis markers on the OH/Room mic tracks, then warp all drums grouped together using warp markers only on the close mics, then switch the OH/Rooms to X-Form (and take a nice vacation while it renders). Sometimes that gives pretty good results. Also, try recutting the drums with a better drummer if all else fails. As I get older, I find myself much less tolerant of sloppy drummers and having to Pro Tool the crap out of loose performances.

thanks, i'll try this
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  #10  
Old 05-19-2009, 10:31 PM
preachers preachers is offline
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Default Re: 7.4.2 elastic audio phase problem

well, in the past a few days, i updated my pt to 8 cs2 and tried the new algorithm EA. i found the new algorithm is worse than the old one, i had tested a multi-drum recording session, i put all tracks to rhythmic mode then timing them, in that session, the verse part have only hi- hat and kick drum, i just use the kick track to set the warp markers, and then the snare track appear some small crakle. i remember there are some guys told me, get rid of all the event marker at all tracks expect kick and snare, but when i did that, there were some random artifacts appeard, sound like a short revese cymbal.
i have no idea with it, great appreciate for any suggestions
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